What is an experienced ref?

[tomegun]

Something from another thread got me thinking about what makes one official more experienced than another. Some might view it as years while some might view it as experience on a certain level.
I know from first hand experience that years of officiating don't and can't make one official more experienced than another if they officiate in different parts of the country. I know guys that have worked so much in so little time that I would have guessed they have been working for about 4 more years than they actually have. There are also officials who have been out there screwing ball games up for 20+ years.
I think the level an official works can play a part in telling the story of their experience. A prime example is Zach Zarba. I'm sure many of us have officiated longer than he has but being on his level has definately made him more experienced.

So what do we look for when we seek out that "more experienced official?" I think I look for someone who is or has been where I want to be. That is not to say I won't listen to others because that isn't the case. I guess experience, like beauty, is in the eye of the beholder.

[brainbrian]

Personally I would think it can't really be measured. Your experience is just something internal that you feel when you're confident enough to make the big and tough calls. And when you just feel comfortable out there all the time, and up to what age you can do before you're outside your comfort zone.

Other factors would be what you mentioned, like years officiating and knowledge of rules.

[JRutledge]

I consider an experience official as someone that been working the varsity level and above for years. Just because someone is experienced at the varsity level, does not translate to other levels. For example I consider myself to be a very experience varsity official, but not very experienced at the college level. I work only a small percentage of college games every year (by choice) because I am committed to accomplishing some things at the HS level first. I guess just like what makes an attractive women, everyone has a different opinion to what features are needed to think someone is beautiful. I just know that when I have an opportunity look for partners, I usually like to work with people that have been around the block at a particular level. Most of the time I do not get that option, so I guess it really does not matter.

Peace

[lukealex]

Myself being very unexperienced in years but experienced in different levels (4th grade girls/boys up to mens A rec league, JH, JV and V HS) gives me a different perspective on how experienced officials are. There are some that I have worked with that have been officiating for many years that I don't think are doing a very good job. The opposite is also true, young officials running good games. Years of experience might just make old habits die hard, or by taking advice and watching how others work can be a blessing.

I believe experience doesn't have much to do with how long you've been officiating, but rather how you handle differing situations.

[Larks]

Somebody told me once that it takes 500 games (at any level) to prepare yourself for the varsity level. The idea was that you'd probably see just about everything by then.

That probably holds true in Ohio to some extent. At FR and JV they assign double headers. Work 3-4x a week for 13 weeks and thats roughly 80 games. Add in some kids stuff here and there and summer ball and 100 games a season is pretty easy to hit. Seems like around here, if you are gonna move up, it takes about 5-7 years so doing the math, 500 games is doable in that time frame.

In my opinion though you also have to weigh what leagues you work. Not all high school leagues, regardless of the level are created equal. Example, in Cincinnati, if you work GCL or GMC boys JV games, you have likely worked a tougher game than 40% the varsity games in the 50 mile vicinity but you get to do it two man vs. three. In my mind, this really builds exerience and confidence.

But to the question...what makes an experienced official? Is the word "experience"? Or is the word Quality?

So what makes a quality official?

In shape? Or at least can run?
Battle tested?
Knows their primary?
Calls the obvious?
Ref's the D?
Trust their P?
Works on their avocation thru camps and clinics?











[Edited by Larks on Jun 29th, 2005 at 02:22 PM]

[ChrisSportsFan]

Great question. A couple of weeks ago, I got to hear Don Daily speak at a camp. If you knew he'd only officiated basketball for 8 years you might form an opinion about his experience but then to learn that he's been working at the D1 level for 6 of them would change that opinion. Of course he's an anomolly. (sp) His first ever 2-man game was the first half of a D1 game when his R got knocked out cold during the jump-ball. I found his story an interesting one.

One measure of experience could be the number of battles an official has been thru and you can't count every game as a battle.

[JRutledge]

Larks,

I was at a camp this past weekend in Ohio. The camp was run by a D1 assignor that also assigned lower level college as well. He said he thinks some officials just have the "gift." He thinks it does not matter how long some officials have been working, he really feels that some guys get it and others will never get it. I tend to agree with that to some extent. I have seen officials that just know what they are supposed to do from jump. I have seen other officials that have been around 20 years and they are still talking about what they used to do 20 years ago and these officials will never get it. I do not think a specific amount of games gives you "automatic" competence. I do believe that experience will help you know how to handle situations better the more you see them. I know I learn every single time I work a game. I have changed things as I see more plays. I do not think just because I worked a lot of games that in itself is a judgment of how good I am. I just think my opinions or philosophies have evolved and I am more confident in what I already believe or what I have been taught over the years.

Peace

[Love this Game]

This is a great topic!

I think what makes an experience official is one knowing the game. I think having played the game at a high level really helps you understand the game and how it is supposed to be played.

Yes some people have the gift they go on the court and it just like they are playing with them. They can feel the flow of the game. They can sense if this game is going to be a running game, or a rough one.

Some people think that knowing all the rules makes you a great official, I totally disagree. This game is so much more than just the rules, this game is abt passion, knowing what to call and knowing when not to call it.

I agree with the person who originated this topic abt the official that have been doing this for 20+ years, there are officials that have been doing this for over 20+ years and are still messing the game up. But there are some that are still great.

My opinion I wish they would go back to a two man crew for a couple of years just to get rid of all the older crew. The three man crew has kept them around too long. I know that is wishfull thinking but it would be nice.

I think being experienced is also how the players accept and respond to you. And how you accept and respond to them. Are you able to talk to them or do you just tell them to do this and do that.

I know when I am the lead, I try my best to never call a 3 sec call because I am constantly talking to the players. Now i have been to some camps and they say, dont do that call the call. But as a player, if the official can talk me out before why slow down the game for that.

Also I think that an experienced official is an official that can give advice to the younger official in a way that they would understand, instead of just letting them sink or swim. I think the older officials are afraid to help the younger ones because they are afraid they will take there jobs from them. I know when I work with a new guy either in a varsity game, a summer league game, or anything I am always talkign to my partner, catching his eye to try and see what he is looking at so i make sure he is not looking at the same.

Every game is a learning experience, you never know what is going to happen, especially if you are working with someone new.

JUST A LITTLE FOOD FOR THOUGHT!!!!

[Edited by Love this Game on Jun 29th, 2005 at 02:55 PM]

[brainbrian]

To be experienced means you can pick up the "flow" of the game and adjust your calls accordinly so that you're not blowing your whistle everytime and enforcing everything, but that you're able to keep games under control using other means than your whistle.

Just because you're experienced at one level doesn't mean you're experienced at all levels. There are some great high school and college refs that can come down and referee a third grade game so wisely and all the parents love him. And there are some that are experienced at the lower levels but not the upper levels and visa-versa. For example I've been told by people that I tend to "stay up" in how I officiate. I call a good high school or 7/8th grade game, but I try to apply the same rules for grade school kids and mess up their games.

[Larks]

Originally posted by JRutledge
I do not think a specific amount of games gives you "automatic" competence.

Someone told me once...

One must do something until the become 'subconciously competent'.....you do it without thinking.....like tying your shoes

[blindzebra]

I think it is someone who gets the job done, but still knows they don't know everything and still need to get better.

[SeanFitzRef]

I agree this is a good topic, but are we substituting the word 'experienced' for the word 'good'? Because IMO the responses that I'm reading are all definitions of good officials, not 'experienced' ones!

I've worked with some officials that have been at it for years, and they call the game as if they are the most important aspects to the game. Their mechanics are almost flawless, but the game is like a whistle-fest.

I've also worked with some newer officials (I've only got 5 years, and they have less than two) that have a solid grasp of the game flow. Mechanics might be sloppy, but the game is played as smooth as silk, no one questions a single call, and the best team wins (as it should be).

So are we trying to equate experienced with good?

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally posted by SeanFitzRef
I agree this is a good topic, but are we substituting the word 'experienced' for the word 'good'?

Bingo!

There's no real correllation between the two imo also.

I've seen relatively inexperienced officials that I thought did an absolutely great job.

I've seen very experienced officials blow chunks.

[zebraman]

Originally posted by Jurassic Referee

Bingo!

There's no real correllation between the two imo also.

I've seen relatively inexperienced officials that I thought did an absolutely great job.

I've seen very experienced officials blow chunks.

Agreed. I've seen some officials who have been exercising bad judgment and exercising poor mechanics and poor communication for 20 years. I've seen some second-year officials who have caught on already. Combine a an official who "gets it" AND a few years of experience and you have something special. Experience in-and-of-itself means nothing.

Z

[brainbrian]

Originally posted by blindzebra
I think it is someone who gets the job done, but still knows they don't know everything and still need to get better.

I did that my first game.