The Finals - Game 1

[BktBallRef]

Thoughts-

-I don't care where he's from, Manu Ginobilli is one of the best players in the league.

-Excellent call by Steve Javie on Ben Wallace's flop. It wasn't a charge and Javie put a stop to the foolishness with the block call. Kudos to Garrettson for watching his partner's back and sticking Wallace in the a$$.

-Boy did they let'em play!!

-I'm sick of that stupid Kryzewski commercial. It was bad enough that we had to withstand it during the NCAA Tourney but this is ridiculous. Enough already.

[drothamel]

I second all of those points. It was a very well-officiated game overall.

[ChuckElias]

Very interesting call in the first half. Don't know if you'll remember it. Ben Wallace got an offensive rebound then went for a strong put-back. He plowed over a Spur (don't know who) who was in the RA. Official called an offensive foul. Of course, Wallace points down at the semi-circle, just showing that he doesn't understand the rule.

Since the play originated in the LDB, the RA rules are not relevant. The easy call is the block, b/c everyone can see the defender's feet in the RA, but he applied the rule correctly. Great call and awareness by the official.

[Dan_ref]

Originally posted by BktBallRef
Thoughts-

-I'm sick of that stupid Kryzewski commercial. It was bad enough that we had to withstand it during the NCAA Tourney but this is ridiculous. Enough already.

What? You got something against a poor kid from Chicago making a litle $$$?

[mick]

Originally posted by ChuckElias
Very interesting call in the first half. Don't know if you'll remember it. Ben Wallace got an offensive rebound then went for a strong put-back. He plowed over a Spur (don't know who) who was in the RA. Official called an offensive foul. Of course, Wallace points down at the semi-circle, just showing that he doesn't understand the rule.

Since the play originated in the LDB, the RA rules are not relevant. The easy call is the block, b/c everyone can see the defender's feet in the RA, but he applied the rule correctly. Great call and awareness by the official.

Chuck,
I don't understand (again).
Would you mind briefly clarifying that rule?
RA --> restricted area
LDB --> ?
mick

[w_sohl]

Originally posted by Dan_ref

What? You got something against a poor kid from Chicago making a litle $$$?

It is an unfair recruiting tool and if you don't think Coach K saw it that when when he signed up you are sadly mistaken. If they are going to run those commercials they should run them regionaly or have one for EVERY D1 school that participates in basketball. It is a recruiting tool disguised as an American Express commercial.

[rainmaker]

Originally posted by BktBallRef
-I'm sick of that stupid Kryzewski commercial. It was bad enough that we had to withstand it during the NCAA Tourney but this is ridiculous. Enough already.

He's got the weirdest voice!

[mick]

Originally posted by w_sohl

It is an unfair recruiting tool and if you don't think Coach K saw it that when when he signed up you are sadly mistaken. If they are going to run those commercials they should run them regionaly or have one for EVERY D1 school that participates in basketball. It is a recruiting tool disguised as an American Express commercial.

Totally agree !
...And not well disguised, either.
mick

---

Jewel, Coach K's whiney whinny voice is killing me U.P. here.

The only problem I had with the game was the timing of the start.

Yes, Tony, Manu is quite special. He runs around like (and reminds me of) a long Steve Nash.

mick

[ChuckElias]

Originally posted by mick
Would you mind briefly clarifying that rule?
RA --> restricted area
LDB --> ?

The common misconception about the Restricted Area (RA) rule is that if contact occurs on any defender in the semi-circle, then there can be no offensive foul. But that's not true. Just to clear up a little.

1) The RA only applies to a secondary (or "help") defender. If A1 drives to the basket and his defender B1 stays with him all the way to the basket, then A1 could be called for an offensive foul, even if the contact occurs in the RA.

2) The RA rules do not apply at all if the play originates within the LDB, the Lower Defensive Box. The LDB is a box that is bounded by the the bottom of the jump circle and the endline, and extends 3' on either side of the lane. If you look at the court diagram at http://www.nba.com/analysis/rules_1....av=ArticleList ,you can see the markings for the 3' "post up" mark outside the lane if you look closely. If the play starts in that box, then anybody can take a charge, even in the RA. (This is what happened on the Wallace play I mentioned above. He rebounded the ball within the LDB, so that's where the play started. Therefore, no RA rules apply.)

3) Even if a secondary defender is within the RA, the offensive player can still be called for an offensive foul if he pushes or "clears out" with the off arm.

[rwest]

Originally posted by ChuckElias

The common misconception about the Restricted Area (RA) rule is that if contact occurs on any defender in the semi-circle, then there can be no offensive foul. But that's not true. Just to clear up a little.

1) The RA only applies to a secondary (or "help") defender. If A1 drives to the basket and his defender B1 stays with him all the way to the basket, then A1 could be called for an offensive foul, even if the contact occurs in the RA.

2) The RA rules do not apply at all if the play originates within the LDB, the Lower Defensive Box. The LDB is a box that is bounded by the the bottom of the jump circle and the endline, and extends 3' on either side of the lane. If you look at the court diagram at http://www.nba.com/analysis/rules_1....av=ArticleList ,you can see the markings for the 3' "post up" mark outside the lane if you look closely. If the play starts in that box, then anybody can take a charge, even in the RA. (This is what happened on the Wallace play I mentioned above. He rebounded the ball within the LDB, so that's where the play started. Therefore, no RA rules apply.)

3) Even if a secondary defender is within the RA, the offensive player can still be called for an offensive foul if he pushes or "clears out" with the off arm.

So, if the offensive player drives to the basket, beating his defender and some interior defender comes over to help out, then if contact occurs within the RA, its a block, correct? Is the line part of the RA? Do both feet have to be within the RA? Can the feet be on the line and the player still be considered in the RA?

[Dan_ref]

Originally posted by mick

Totally agree !
...And not well disguised, either.
mick

I don't agree, and apparently neither does the NCAA.

It's just another in a series of annoying comercials.

[w_sohl]

Originally posted by Dan_ref
I don't agree, and apparently neither does the NCAA.

It's just another in a series of annoying comercials.

How can you not agree, everything he says is things he would say to a recruit, it gives more exposure to the University, talks about winning championships and turning boys into men. If that isn't recruiting language I don't know what is. I don't think the NCAA has really had to deal with this type of RECRUITING before therefore they don't really know what to do, and they aren't going to do anything till member institutions start speaking up.

[Edited by w_sohl on Jun 10th, 2005 at 01:08 PM]

[Dan_ref]

Originally posted by w_sohl

How can you not agree, everything he says is things he would say to a recruit, it gives more exposure to the University, talks about winning championships and turning boys into men. If that isn't recruiting language I don't know what is. I don't think the NCAA has really had to deal with this type of RECRUITING before therefore they don't really know what to do, and they aren't going to do anything till member institutions start speaking up.

[Edited by w_sohl on Jun 10th, 2005 at 01:08 PM]

What would you expect him to talk about if not these things? AE pays Tiger Woods to talk about what he's known for, Robert Deniro to talk about what he's know for, Ellen Degeneres to talk about what she's known for...well, not quite...and Coach K to talk about what he's known for.

BTW the NCAA does know what to do about it, they've stated it's no big deal to them.

[Goose]

I would agree that these commercials are annoying.

I guess what irritates me the most is coach K saying that he is a Leader first, then a basketball coach. Leader? Leader of what? He's a basketball coach. Teacher I could, and would buy lock stock and barrel, but leader?

I just wonder if John Wooden saw himself as a leader or a teacher that just happened to coach basketball.

It appears someone's head has gotten a tad to large for their hair IMO.


goose

[w_sohl]

Originally posted by Dan_ref

What would you expect him to talk about if not these things? AE pays Tiger Woods to talk about what he's known for, Robert Deniro to talk about what he's know for, Ellen Degeneres to talk about what she's known for...well, not quite...and Coach K to talk about what he's known for.

BTW the NCAA does know what to do about it, they've stated it's no big deal to them.

It is a recruiting tool period. It undoubtedly affects kids decisions when they see this. Coach K is in the business of influcing an individuals decision, hell if I remember corretly he even says something along the lines of if you come to duke he wont only make you a better basketball player, he'll make you a better man. HMMMM, now if that doesn't sound like a recruiting ploy please tell what does. Ellen Degenerate doesn't work for a university nor does she mention one, Tiger woods neve mentions where he went to college, Coach K asks kids to come to Duke in the commercial, maybe not word for word but he does.

As far as the NCAA goes, we all know they don't have a clue what they are doing, big time money programs get caught handing out thousands of dollars and get a simple slap on the wrist while others give a simple ride howm to and individual and 10 bucks for something to each on and a guy loses his job and a university loses a scholarship and forfeits games. The NCAA doesn't have a clue, Coach K is a poster boy for the NCAA, you really think they are going to damage their income?