AAU action

[Redhouse]

A1 dribbles down the lane and gets fouled. A is in the bonus. A2 and B2 then square off and push each other. My partner and I both jump in quickly and break things up. Being that this is AAU ball we decided to toss both players. We informed the table of the foul by B1 and then notify them that A2 and B2 have been ejected for flagrant T's. We also notify the coach then player of the ejections.

This is how we handled it. We did not shoot any T's and just played the 1 and 1 with the lane occupied. I am really not sure if we were suppose to shoot T's or not but something told me that we shouldn't shoot and just let them (for lack of a better word) offset each other.

Any comments?

[bob jenkins]

Originally posted by Redhouse
A1 dribbles down the lane and gets fouled. A is in the bonus. A2 and B2 then square off and push each other. My partner and I both jump in quickly and break things up. Being that this is AAU ball we decided to toss both players. We informed the table of the foul by B1 and then notify them that A2 and B2 have been ejected for flagrant T's. We also notify the coach then player of the ejections.

This is how we handled it. We did not shoot any T's and just played the 1 and 1 with the lane occupied. I am really not sure if we were suppose to shoot T's or not but something told me that we shouldn't shoot and just let them (for lack of a better word) offset each other.

Any comments?

Yes, the fouls by A2 and B2 offset, but they happened after the foul on A1. So, A1 shoots the 1-and-1 with the lane cleared, then use the arrow to determine the throw-in.

[Dan_ref]

Originally posted by Redhouse
A1 dribbles down the lane and gets fouled. A is in the bonus. A2 and B2 then square off and push each other. My partner and I both jump in quickly and break things up. Being that this is AAU ball we decided to toss both players. We informed the table of the foul by B1 and then notify them that A2 and B2 have been ejected for flagrant T's. We also notify the coach then player of the ejections.

This is how we handled it. We did not shoot any T's and just played the 1 and 1 with the lane occupied. I am really not sure if we were suppose to shoot T's or not but something told me that we shouldn't shoot and just let them (for lack of a better word) offset each other.

Any comments?

1. You should have shot the FTs with the lane vacant & gone to the arrow, ball at midcourt.

2. My game was more fun that your game.

[Redhouse]

i thought that we should have done that. I was getting tired and could not think to well.

Dan, I have more.

[ChrisSportsFan]

I wonder if they have AAU boxing. ??

I wonder if at one of the boxing events they've ever been cruising thru the tournament and a basketball game just broke out. ??
Nobody really understood why but two fighters got ticked off at each other and started a game of 1 0n 1, make-it take-it.

Just wondering. ??

[Redhouse]

The cut man throws in a basketball and the guy that holds the bucket for the boxers to spit in holds the bucket over his head and they go at it.

It starts out 1 on 1 and then all of the sudden from nowhere 8 spectators jump into the ring and they have a full 5 on 5 game taking place.

[BktBallRef]

Originally posted by bob jenkins

Yes, the fouls by A2 and B2 offset, but they happened after the foul on A1. So, A1 shoots the 1-and-1 with the lane cleared, then use the arrow to determine the throw-in.

NFHS, NCAA, or both?

[Lotto]

Originally posted by BktBallRef

NFHS, NCAA, or both?

In NCAA, the way the OP handled it is correct. The double T goes to POI, which is the 1-1 FTs.

(Could I pack any more abbreviations into one sentence?)

BTW (another!), "offset" is a football term. The proper term here is simply a double foul (in this case a double technical foul, or even more properly a double flagrant technical foul), which carries a certain penalty that does not include FTs by either team.

[Back In The Saddle]

Originally posted by Lotto

In NCAA, the way the OP handled it is correct. The double T goes to POI, which is the 1-1 FTs.

(Could I pack any more abbreviations into one sentence?)

BTW (another!), "offset" is a football term. The proper term here is simply a double foul (in this case a double technical foul, or even more properly a double flagrant technical foul), which carries a certain penalty that does not include FTs by either team.

You might want to have a look at 10-4-4 penalty.

[Lotto]

Originally posted by Back In The Saddle
You might want to have a look at 10-4-4 penalty.

I'm not sure what you're referring to. NCAA 10-4.4 refers to double indirect technical fouls, which has nothing to do with this play.

If you're referring to my comment that "offset" is a football term and not a basketball term, I recognize that the NCAA rulebook refers to "offsetting" fouls in certain A.R.'s, but I still think it's better, especially for beginners, to think in terms of the language that's defined in Rule 4.

[Edited by Lotto on Apr 25th, 2005 at 07:31 PM]

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally posted by Lotto

I'm not sure what you're referring to. NCAA 10-4.4 refers to double indirect technical fouls, which has nothing to do with this play.

If you're referring to my comment that "offset" is a football term and not a basketball term, I recognize that the NCAA rulebook refers to "offsetting" fouls in certain A.R.'s, but I still think it's better, especially for beginners, to think in terms of the language that's defined in Rule 4.

And beginners (most of whom use NFHS rules) should then not think in terms of the language defined in FED Rule 10, which uses the term "offsetting" several times in R10-4-4 and associated case plays?

The FED obviously thinks that "offsetting" is a legitimate basketball term-i.e. because of it's actual usage in the rules. The NCAA uses the term in it's AR's too. That it is a legitimate basketball term used by the rulesmakers was BITS' point.

[Edited by Jurassic Referee on Apr 25th, 2005 at 08:15 PM]

[26 Year Gap]

Could I pack any more abbreviations into one sentence?)


use abbr for abbreviations.

[Lotto]

Originally posted by Jurassic Referee

And beginners (most of whom use NFHS rules) should then not think in terms of the language defined in FED Rule 10, which uses the term "offsetting" several times in R10-4-4 and associated case plays?

The FED obviously thinks that "offsetting" is a legitimate basketball term-i.e. because of it's actual usage in the rules. The NCAA uses the term in it's AR's too. That it is a legitimate basketball term used by the rulesmakers was BITS' point.

[Edited by Jurassic Referee on Apr 25th, 2005 at 08:15 PM]

I hear what you're saying, but I still think it's better for us (and especially beginners) to generally stick to the terms that defined in Rule 4. (These definitions cause enough debate; terms that are not officially defined can be, in my experience, more confusing.) That's my personal opinion; I completely understand BiTS's and your points.

BTW, although offsetting fouls might be referred to constantly in the NFHS rulebook, but my post was about NCAA rules. (I don't have an NFHS rulebook and don't officiate under these rules, so I can't say anything about them.) This is one of the reasons I was confused by BiTS's post; I was talking about NCAA rules and his rules reference was (apparently) to NFHS.