Why do we basketball refs talk more

[Forksref]

In our association, we have probably 10 times more BB officials than VB. And I myself can only name one soccer official. We have many more BB officials than we do any other sport. In FB we have just barely enough to cover our schedules.

[ref2coach]

Originally posted by SamIAm
Basketball is more popular, therefore more people like to talk about basketball.

In the USA yes. In the world, not even close.

There are 7 of 8 different soccer officials forums that I "check in on" that all are as active or more active than the basketball forum here.

[SamIAm]

Originally posted by refnrev
I'm a 3 sport official, B'ball, Soccer, and V'ball. I'm always checking the other sports, but on this forum B'ball has 125,565 posts, Soccer has 482, and Volleyball has 591. I'd like to "talk shop" with refs in the other two, but there isn't much activity. Why do you think we basketball officials talk so much more than officials in other sports? What say you?

Originally posted by SamIAm
Basketball is more popular, therefore more people like to talk about basketball.

In the USA yes. In the world, not even close.

There are 7 of 8 different soccer officials forums that I "check in on" that all are as active or more active than the basketball forum here.

Sounds like your original post should have been, "Why is the Official Forum soccer forum used so little?".

[Almost Always Right]

It all has to do with passion and scrutiny. The good officials I know(who all happen to be basketball officials) work so hard on every aspect of their game. There are about 10 or so of us in our H.S. association that REALLY knit pick on as many aspects as we can. We don't take it personally but we take it as a challenge to be better than we were last time. I am not so sure you get that in other sports(or even that you can get that in other sports)?
AAR

[FrankHtown]

I think it is very self-serving to be of the opinion other officials are not as passionate about moving up in their respective sports. I know for a fact the USSF (United States Soccer Federation) is very active in recruiting and training referees on a local and national level. They conduct physical fitness testing of their referees, even at the local level, and your ranking is directly impacted by those results. If your one of the "good old boys" but can't meet or exceed the phyical testing, you cannot move up, and can, in fact, move down. It is an honor to be assigned to do a World Cup or Olympic Game, similar to being appointed to officiate basketball in the Olympics, the Pan-Am games, or Final Four.

[Almost Always Right]

There are, of course, exceptions to everything. I did not mean to imply that NO OTHER OFFICIALS are as passionate as bball refs.
Of course every sport official has passion but bball refs seem to tell more people about it.

[JRutledge]

Basketball is a 12 month sport. There is nothing that can stop you from playing a game indoors year-round. Baseball, Football, Soccer, and Softball are sports where the weather can dictate how you play and when you play. I have never heard of a soccer rainout, but I do not know of anyone that plays soccer 12 months out of the year like they do in basketball. It is March 3rd and the still extremely cold where I live. I do not know many people that want to go outside and play soccer in this weather. Because of that fact, I think that officials across this country have more to talk about. More plays, situations and experiences. It is even hard for me to talk about football and baseball because it has been several months since I have worked a game in either. I am sure the same goes for many soccer refs that have not worked games for some time.

Peace

[Back In The Saddle]

First of all, there are sooooo many basketball officials. I got my first varsity football assignment during my rookie year. I had multiple baseball/softball assignors working me 2-3 sets of games per day. My first year of basketball, I was lucky to get a game each week. There just are not as many officials working in most other sports. That means more people talking.

Second, the nature of basketball, with 10 players playing vigorously within a small, confined area means you get a lot of interesting and unusual situations, bang-bang plays, etc. There are a lot more things to discuss here than in many other sports. You have to render so many decisions every game on things that happen so quickly, that you have to talk and think about a lot of "stuff" just to be prepared to get the call right when it happens to you.

Third, the nature of basketball officiating is much more competitive than other sports. There are so many officials chasing so few spots in the "higher up" leagues that there is a tremendous amount of discussion, activity and effort put into analyzing anything and everything related to the game. Everybody is looking for that little edge that will get them noticed. Look at the inane holy wars that break out about such seemingly insignificant subjects as patent leather v. polished shoes, pleated v. regular pants, belt v. beltless, etc. Such trivial concerns matter in basketball officiating, but wouldn't if there were fewer officials.

Fourth, there are so many basketball officials coming and going all the time. So we end up having the same discussions over and over and over again. How many backcourt violation questions have we fielded this year? How many self-pass questions? Every time somebody new asks a backcourt question, there are many more people who are listening to the discussion, learning along with them. Those people then ask even more questions that have been asked before. A liner increase in the number of officials translates to an exponential increase in the amount of communication that must take place.

Fifth, we're so darned long winded! And sometimes we have to be. Nobody can agree on the definition of anything. So sometimes we go on for a page just trying to decide what it is we're talking about.

Sixth, there are so many grey areas to argue about. Want to start a fight in a group of officials, ask them what to do about any situation with 2.8 seconds left on the clock

Seventh, why wouldn't we? It's fun

Eight, did I mention we're sometimes long-winded?

[Edited by Back In The Saddle on Mar 3rd, 2005 at 06:58 PM]

[Mark Padgett]

Originally posted by FrankHtown
It is an honor to be assigned to do a World Cup

What's that?

[Back In The Saddle]

Originally posted by refnrev
I'm a 3 sport official, B'ball, Soccer, and V'ball. I'm always checking the other sports, but on this forum B'ball has 125,565 posts, Soccer has 482, and Volleyball has 591. I'd like to "talk shop" with refs in the other two, but there isn't much activity. Why do you think we basketball officials talk so much more than officials in other sports? What say you?

If you look carefully, you'll notice that JurrasicReferee, rainmaker, ChuckElias, JRutledge and BktBallRef account for more than 90% of those 125,565 posts!

[refnrev]

Ref2Coach,
What are some of those soccer sites you metioned? I'd like to see them since Spring USSF play starts in a couple of weeks or so.

[refnrev]

Originally posted by South GA BBall Ref
I think we "talk" more because in basketball, there are so many situations that require one to use his/her judgement in applying the "spirit and intent" of the rules. Basketball, unlike football, has so many areas that require a split second decision and you just can't "wave it off".

SGBBR,
No offense, my friend, but no sport requires more use of "the spirit and intent" than soccer does. The use of "advantage" to "play on" is the most prominent example of this. Likewise, the offside call of a player being "involved" or "not involved" in the play is all about "spirit and intent." You must make split second judgements -- and you are officiating 22 players with 2 referees or 1 referee and two assistants on the side of a field that can be as large as 110 X 65 yards in HS or up to 130 X 100 yards in FIFA play.

[ChuckElias]

Originally posted by Mark Padgett

What's that?

It's the only time that Americans are allowed, by law, to care about soccer.

[QuebecRef87]

Originally posted by Back In The Saddle

If you look carefully, you'll notice that JurrasicReferee, rainmaker, ChuckElias, JRutledge and BktBallRef account for more than 90% of those 125,565 posts!

Not quite true. They didn't write all of their posts in the Basketball Forum!

[Mark Padgett]

Originally posted by ChuckElias

It's the only time that Americans are allowed, by law, to care about soccer.

What's that?