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Old Tue Feb 22, 2005, 02:09pm
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Question

I noticed that someone else asked for opinions about Dale Kelley's Camp, so I will just read those posts; I was wondering if anyone out there has been to the George Toliver Camp in VA. When I played in high school, my team used to play at the camp held in conjunction with his. I remember it being the first time that I ever saw official's practicing. I just wondered if anyone had any opinions about the camp, good or bad.

Thanks,

Daniel


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Old Tue Feb 22, 2005, 02:53pm
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I attended his camp back in the summer of 2002. It was all NBA refs who taught us, it was interesting listening to them speak, but they are very arrogant and feel that they are the best in the world and when they critique you, you should be glad that they are there. You get taped and there are a couple of assignors there, also the NBA supr comes and watches for a day. I enjoyed it, and you learn NBA mechanics, and it taught me a lot for other camps. On the final night there is a chance to win NBA merchandise that Toliver has accumulated along the way.
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Old Wed Feb 23, 2005, 06:24am
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I attended about 5 years ago and enjoyed it. I agree with LouisanaDave about the instructors. It doesn't take you long to realize they are playing mind games with you, but I did learn a lot from the camp. One downside is it is expensive. I think it was $425 when I attended. My association pays 1/2 of the fee (up to $150) one time, so this helped. You have 3 games a day for 4 days and if you aren't on the floor, you are taping someone else or you are watching film and/or working on mechanics. Overall, it was a good experience for me.
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Old Wed Feb 23, 2005, 07:17am
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Camp info

Are there any websites to go to for camp listings like these: Tollivers Camp etc....?
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Old Wed Feb 23, 2005, 07:52am
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Here is the link to George Toliver. It hasn't been updated in a while.


http://www.toliverbasketball.com/
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Old Wed Feb 23, 2005, 01:02pm
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Cool

Thanks for the replies everyone, it is much appreciated.

Daniel

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Old Wed Feb 23, 2005, 01:40pm
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Quote:
Originally posted by dblref
I attended about 5 years ago and enjoyed it. I agree with LouisanaDave about the instructors. It doesn't take you long to realize they are playing mind games with you, but I did learn a lot from the camp. One downside is it is expensive. I think it was $425 when I attended. My association pays 1/2 of the fee (up to $150) one time, so this helped. You have 3 games a day for 4 days and if you aren't on the floor, you are taping someone else or you are watching film and/or working on mechanics. Overall, it was a good experience for me.
I've heard that the intrsuctors berate you and make fun of you? True or false?
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Old Wed Feb 23, 2005, 01:51pm
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drothamel, which high school?
I played at Turner Ashby when Ralph Sampson played for Harrisonburg and while Dell Curry played at Fort.
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Old Wed Feb 23, 2005, 02:06pm
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Imagomer-

I played at little ole' Fluvanna from 95-98.

Daniel

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Old Wed Feb 23, 2005, 02:33pm
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Snake it is true that they berate you, I was never made fun of though, but I felt that since Toliver has a girl who is a really good girl's basketball prospect that he tends to favor the women referee's that are there. We got berated by Tony Brothers about how great he is and how the NBA ref's are the greatest in the world and that we have no right to say anything when they critique us. That and they kept saying if you dont like it, Toliver will cut you a cut right then and there and you can leave, cause they are doing us a favor by being there, blah blah
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Old Wed Feb 23, 2005, 02:41pm
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Quote:
Originally posted by LouisianaDave
We got berated by Tony Brothers about how great he is and how the NBA ref's are the greatest in the world
You gotta admit, they're pretty darn good. You may not agree with NBA philosophy, but those boys (and gal) can flat out referee.

Quote:
and that we have no right to say anything when they critique us.
I've heard this from D3 officials.

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cause they are doing us a favor by being there, blah blah
Agree with you here. I payed $450 and you're doing ME a favor? Yeah right.
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Old Thu Feb 24, 2005, 06:59am
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Quote:
Originally posted by Snake~eyes
Quote:
Originally posted by dblref
I attended about 5 years ago and enjoyed it. I agree with LouisanaDave about the instructors. It doesn't take you long to realize they are playing mind games with you, but I did learn a lot from the camp. One downside is it is expensive. I think it was $425 when I attended. My association pays 1/2 of the fee (up to $150) one time, so this helped. You have 3 games a day for 4 days and if you aren't on the floor, you are taping someone else or you are watching film and/or working on mechanics. Overall, it was a good experience for me.
I've heard that the intrsuctors berate you and make fun of you? True or false?
This wasn't true when I attended, although they did go to great lengths to make sure you know who was in charge. Case in point, at the end of each day, we met in the classroom and went over the day's events. At the end of the 2nd day, one of the instructors was telling us how bad we looked, what terrible calls we made, we were out of position, yada, yada, yada (sort of like boot camp). After about 30 minutes of these mind games, Tolliver walked up to the podium, slapped his check book down and told us how diappointed he was that we weren't learning anything. He picked up his check book, started waving it in the air and said that obviously he wasn't teaching us anything and that he should refund our money (think I paid $425)and who was the first one that wanted their money back? Of course, nobody asked for their money back. If it had been at the end of the 3rd day, I would have taken him up on it, just for the hell of it. I guess he thought he would get inside our head and make us work harder. I've been married 37 years and my wife is a master at this -- better than Tolliver could ever hope to.

Overall, I thought it was an excellent camp and you just needed to understand what mind games they played.
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Old Thu Feb 24, 2005, 07:06am
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Quote:
Originally posted by LouisianaDave
Snake it is true that they berate you, I was never made fun of though, but I felt that since Toliver has a girl who is a really good girl's basketball prospect that he tends to favor the women referee's that are there. We got berated by Tony Brothers about how great he is and how the NBA ref's are the greatest in the world and that we have no right to say anything when they critique us. That and they kept saying if you dont like it, Toliver will cut you a cut right then and there and you can leave, cause they are doing us a favor by being there, blah blah
Tony Brothers told me that he was invited to a D-1 camp, and subsequently hired, before he ever did a varsity HS game. I asked him how this was possible and why it happended to him. He told me his HS assignor did not like him and would not assign him any varsity games because he (Tony)was a smart @ss. Not sure I believe any of his BS, but I agree with his assignor. There were a couple of really good guys there - Fred Robinson(?), Tom Washington, Sean (?).

I never saw them yell or scream at anyone, or put a hand on anyone, but they do like to play mind games.
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Old Thu Feb 24, 2005, 07:21am
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I agree there are a few good guys, Washington, Leroy Richardson, Sean Foster, but to me the mind games are dumb. It sounds like they do the same spiel on all campers every year. We are there to learn and possibly advance our officiating career not to be put in boot camp to be broken down and built back up. If I wanted that I would go be a jarhead.
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