Profanity and a deaf ear!

[Dan_ref]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by JRutledge

I completely understand TH. You have a state policy in place that mandates you to do certain things. There is nothing wrong with that, but in my area and others, there is no such "specific" policy. In 10-3-8b, you are right that certain language or behaviors can and should be T'd. But I really do not think anyone is objecting to that. It is just who is saying what to whom. I had a game were I fouled out a kid, and as I was reporting the kid passed me and said "I did not f**king touch him." Well I immediately gave him a T, and I was the only one that could have heard him. The coach wanted and explaination, and I gave it to him and we had no further problems. But even if he was not fouling out of the game, all that I would have done is give the kid a T, that is it. I would not consider the action flagrant unless that kid threatend me directly or tried to intimidate me in some way. Neither happen and a just giving him a T was enough. But if NC has different rules, you have to adhere to their rules and if I lived there, I would do the same. But in this area, the kid would have to be directing his/her comments toward me or an opponent in a certain way for me to just eject them.

Putting aside state mandated ejections for profanity this
is an interesting discussion. I think Rut is correct,
it comes down to a matter of perception in a lot of cases.
If in Rut's case the layer screams "I did not f**king touch
him." then there's no question, T and possible ejection.
If he says it to you as you're reporting the foul then
you've got to bang him, it's just you and him in the middle
of the floor and most people can lipread what was just said,
even if only you heard it. But if you're lining up for free throws and the player wanders over, covers his mouth and
says this mano-a-mano I think I might at most give him a
stern warning or just tell him I disagree. Bottom line is
different people have different tolerance for this kind of
thing, my letting it go makes it no tougher for the next guy
who decides *not* to let it go.

[Brian Watson]

I had a situation a week ago that goes along with the original intent of the thread. Partner calls a foul, and I line the players up for the free throws. The girl who was called for the foul looks at me and says "That was a sh***y call" .

I whack her and the coach asked for an explaination, and I thought his skull was going to come out of this skin. He gave me the "we're down by 15, maybe it is just frustration speil" and I "shouldn't be looking for T's this late in the year", but I was amazed that he could have cared less at the unsportsmanlike act she committed. He carried on so much I had to just walk away before I dropped one on him, it still bugs me that he didn't care what she did, but that I had the nerve to T her up.

This is where sportsmanship went downhill... when the coaches stop giving a damn or don't have the onions to disipline their players.

[Hawks Coach]

It is unfortunate that coaches get caught up in winning and losing so much that they lose all other perspective. I would have no problem with you T'ing my player for profanity, and if I knew she did it, she would be on the bench next to me - of course I don't have high school varsity, but I don't think my attitude would be much different if I did. I probably would not remove a child for game for profanity, while at the MS level they will sit.

On Sunday, we played another team from our AAU club in a league game. I know the players, coaches, and parents and have a good relationship with many of them. I got a complaint from one player on their team about an alleged obscenity from one of my players. I immediately addressed the situation privately with her, and she of course denied doing anything wrong. I was sure to tell her that I did not know what happened, I wasn't on the court. But I made it clear that if a ref heard her say anything like she had been acused of saying to an opposing player, she could be T'd up or ejected (and I would hope you all would). If it was just a T, I explained that on my team she would still have a spot waiting on the bench. Next week after tryouts, I will have this discussion with my entire team about how they will comport themselves on the bench and in games.

I want my teams to be passionate about the games and about winning. The FIFA fair play guidelines even say that you need to put forth an all out effort on the field to be fair to those who came to have a sporting contest. But all that passion must come with self control. I think we all need to teach sportsmanship. And coaches can have selfish reasons for wanting control, because the self control that comes with sportsmanship also has side benefits of better discipline in all aspects of the game.

[AK ref SE]

Hawks Coach-
When I originally posted this thread! I was looking at this from what the coaches response was to my giving the player a "T". I am glad that you would sit the player down at least for the a time! Like I said in the beginning, the response of the coach telling me "I need a deaf ear" really shocked me!

AK ref SE

[moose69]

Hhahaha, to shock the coach as soon as he said that it should have falled upon a deaf ear, you coulda T'd him for teling you how to you your job.
joking, i guess it's just that the softball season is 2 months away and that's kind of a softball mind frame.


Cheers, Tyler

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Last month there was a lengthy discussion regarding profanity and I cannot forget what string it was in BUT I got on my soap box about the use of vulgarity and how the NFHS and NCAA rules handle the penalties for using a vulgarity. The F-word is a vulgarity and the NFHS penalty for using a vulgarity is disqualification for players, substitutes, and bench personel, and disqualification and ejection for the head coach.

I am no prude but whether it is a high school game or a college game, there is no place for vulgarity. A flagrant technical foul is the only correct action to take. I am the most ferverent defender of the First Amendent you will find but a basketball game is not a democracy. A basketball game is just that a game. And why do I say that, please read on.

UCLA went 30-0 1972-73 and won the NCAA title, but North Carolina State Univ. went 27-0 that year but was on probation and was not allowed to play in the post-season. The next season the two teams met late in the regular season and both team were undefeated. UCLA had Bill Walton and NCSU had David Thompson. UCLA won that game, but the two teams would meet one more time that season, in the Natioal Semi-finals. NCSU won that game in double overtime in one of the all-time great basketball games ever played. And the comment I will always remember is the Norm Sloan (NCSU head coach) telling the press that it was nice to win but there were 500 million Chinese who didn't even know that the game was played.