First time this has happend...

[MegatronOSU]

Hey guys/gals, first time poster, long time reader. Been reading these forums for about 2 years now and I have to say this is easily one of the best tools I have found for developing my officiating skills.

I've been refing for about 6 years now. Three years doing HS ball (I'm another Portland guy from the PBOA). I think of myself as an above average official, but I've still got stuff to work on (and I'm always willing to take advice from experienced officials) and I try to set one or two goals each year to work on. This year its coach-ref relationship and game management, last year it was traveling. I know I'm not ready for the "big time" varsity games and thats fine with me as I don't expect to have a full varsity schedule this early. The reason why I'm posting is I had a situation tonight, that I'd like some advice on....

I had a double-header Freshman and JV girls tonight. First game, is well, a freshman girls game. Coach for home team is chirping quite frequently early on, but I'm ignoring him. Two times in the first half, his player comes down with a rebound and without any contact from the other team, his player falls to the ground. Both my partner and I blow travel. The second time this happens, he's PO'd, and yells at me after I call a second travel "How can you call that!!! That's TWO times now!!!" Having no choice, I had to whack him (he immediately sits, knowing he's lost his box).

At half time, he asks what could he have done differently. Since he was professional, I answer his question and say his tone was not appropriate or professional, which is why he earned the T. I suggest speaking, in the future, to officials in a professional manner to have questions answered (which I explained if he does to me I'll always attempt to answer his questions).

Third quarter goes by without incident. Fourth quarter is halfway done. His team just scores to close the gap, he yells for timeout. Before I heard the timeout request, Red had already inbounded the ball, so I ignored the request. At a break he asked why the timeout wasn't granted, and I explained that your team has to be in control of the ball to have a timeout granted while the ball is live. He didn't like this and threw his hands up in frustration (nothing major and I ignored it).

At the end of the game, I'm standing away from the teams opposite the table, and he breaks his team huddle and singles me out to say loudly "You know I've got to work on my tone, you need to read the rule book. You are the worst official I've seen this year!!!" I thank him and inform him I will be reporting this to my commissioner. Now after the game I should have exited the court, but I stood off to the side while awaiting the JV game to start. As he's exiting (close to me), he singles me out again, and says pretty much what he said before, with some "added stuff".

After this I go to the locker room (which is what I should have done immediately after the first game) and wait for my partner to arrive. He shows up, we go through the pre-game, and head back up to the court. As I'm observing warmups, I notice that guess who is back? The freshman coach, and oh joy, he's talking to the JV coach, and (double joy) he's now sitting at the table and he's the PA announcer for the JV game. I previously had informed my partner of this, so that he was aware of what happend in the last game.

First half goes smoothly, much better teams, coaches, and abilities. But I do hear some chirping coming from him at the scorer's table. Now the chirping wasn't through the PA system, but through himself while the microphone was off. I ignore him as I've got bigger things to worry about and the JV game was going smoothly at that point.

Halfway through the third quarter, I blow a foul against his team and as I'm reporting, I can hear him talking and shaking his head at the table about the call I just made. I've had enough with this guy and I inform game management that the game will not continue until he is removed from the table. He doesn't like it, home coach doesn't like it, but he leaves and game continues. Game ends and I leave.....

Naturally, I filed a report with the commish of our association, but I'm still wondering what I could have done differently. First time I've removed anyone since my old rec ball and IM days. I know I should have gone to the locker room earlier in between games and perhaps spoken with the AD when I saw him at the table for the second game, but I didn't and that's water under the bridge now. Any suggestions/tips? Would you have done that? Sorry if this seems long or if there are typos as it's late and I've got to work early in the AM.

Thanks in advance!

[TimTaylor]

Welcome fellow PBOA member!

It's that time of the season...emotions are high, tempers are flaring & raw nerves are abundant. Difficult as it can be at times, it's still important that we as officials remain the calm voice of reason in an otherwise chaotic world....that said, the "calm voice of reason" doesn't have to tolerate being unjustifiably yelled at.

First off, you answered the biggest part of your own question - when the final horn sounds, get out of there. The less post game opportunity a coach has to approach you the better - none would be ideal. Personally I'd like to be out the door before the echo of the final horn fades, & it's something I discuss with my partner at the half. The R should take advantage of a time out or other break in play asap after the midpoint of the 4th quarter to briefly check with the official scorekeeper at the table to make sure everything is kosher. I actually tell them that at the end of the game I will look over at them, & if they need me at the table wave me over - otherwise we're out of there. Ditto at the half - meet your partner at mid-court opposite table & stay there until the players have cleared the floor & headed to their locker room or the corner, quickly approach the table to verify the arrow is switched, then get out of there to yours.

As to the JV game situation, remember that it's not personal - every game is a new game. Don't let the fact that he was at the table acting as announcer make you act any differently. Go to the table, introduce yourself to the scorekeepers & clock operator & ask if they have any questions, just like you normally would. IMHO, saying something to the AD at this point would have been a mistake - makes it look like you have some animosity towards the coach. By not doing so you took the high road and gave the FR coach a chance to act like an adult - that he chose not to was his responsibility......and he suffered the consequences of his actions.

Just out of curiosity, which school was it at?

[Edited by TimTaylor on Feb 18th, 2005 at 05:30 AM]

[tomegun]

Tim, I'm curious about how you leave the court. Walk or run?

[ChrisSportsFan]

Get outta there! I don't run off but it's definately a hustle off the court. That could have helped and maybe he would still have been stupid but he'd have to come looking for me. Oh, and the report to your commissioner thing is a definate.

[mick]

Originally posted by MegatronOSU
Two times in the first half, his player comes down with a rebound and without any contact from the other team, his player falls to the ground. Both my partner and I blow travel. The second time this happens, he's PO'd, and yells at me after I call a second travel "How can you call that!!! That's TWO times now!!!" Having no choice, I had to whack him (he immediately sits, knowing he's lost his box).

MegatronOSU,
Welcome to the forum.

The coach obviously did not understand the first call.

After the second call and after the coach yelled:

"Stop" your partner from proceeding;

Jog to the coach;

Quickly explain the travel;

Nod your head to his retort;

Go to position;

Give your partner a "Go."

mick

[tomegun]

Originally posted by ChrisSportsFan
Get outta there! I don't run off but it's definately a hustle off the court. That could have helped and maybe he would still have been stupid but he'd have to come looking for me. Oh, and the report to your commissioner thing is a definate.

I asked this question because I'm not running off the court. The only reason I can think about for doing this is if the outcome of the game is going to cause fans to storm the court for a celebration. I don't even know if I would call it a hustle. I'm taking a direct path to the locker room at a steady/normal/deliberate pace. I don't have a reason to "run from the scene of the crime."

[ditttoo]

Gotta get out of there! You also mentioned that you left without your partner - where was your partner? You need to BOTH leave immediately TOGETHER.

Now, he's either still fussing and continuing the conflict for one of several reasons...he's genuinely stupid which may be true or at least in some part....he's just that way and even fusses at the TV games he watches....or there was something legitimate about your calling that upset him. Whichever the case is, there is something here for you to learn from (unless we learn, we're apt to repeat); what was it? Step back a bit and be brutally objective - have your partner offer their critique - review the calls that seem to upset the coach to look for an understanding of frustration and more importantly look for ways to avoid similar responses in future games.

Hang in there...great character builder.

[MegatronOSU]

Good tips - Tim, the game was at Centennial HS vs David Douglas...

You know in the past, during a heated game, both my partner and myself have booked it out of there, so I'm familiar with getting out of dodge quickly....

This game wasn't heated and the coach for the most part after his T, sat down and didn't say anything to me or my partner. The first time I really heard him after the T was after the game.

My partner was/is still rather new, a little quiet, improved since I saw her last, but still need to "blow" the whistle. Her whistle is kind of quiet. In any event, both our jackets were at the table (again should have grabbed them at halftime). The reason I didn't is that I've done probably close to 400-500 games since the last time something like this has happened. I've done this with heated Boys JV games and 6th grade middle school games Rarely have I had a coach single me out after the game.

I talked to my partner at halftime of the freshman game, she agreed with the T. I asked her if she saw any contact by the Red team, which caused the white player to fall. She said she didn't. After the game we waited at half court for both teams to disperse, we grabbed our gear, and we did both leave together.

Probably, for the future I should identify these troublesome situations and get out of there as quickly as possible. People are right, it is a good character builder, in fact this has re-affirmed my desire to be a ref and improve on any aspects of officiating that I can...

I'm definately ready for a break though (end of season burnout) :P

[Smitty]

Originally posted by MegatronOSU
I've been refing for about 6 years now. Three years doing HS ball (I'm another Portland guy from the PBOA). I think of myself as an above average official

No offense, but 3 years of HS officiating rarely makes anyone above average. Are you a regular member yet? I think Camron posted some interesting stats stating something like 80% of officials think they are above average. That means 30% are overzealous. Take your time and realize that there are so many of us in our association who are vying for those coveted varsity games.

[Dan_ref]

Originally posted by MegatronOSU
Hey guys/gals, first time poster, long time reader. Been reading these forums for about 2 years now and I have to say this is easily one of the best tools I have found for developing my officiating skills.

I've been refing for about 6 years now. Three years doing HS ball (I'm another Portland guy from the PBOA). I think of myself as an above average official, but I've still got stuff to work on (and I'm always willing to take advice from experienced officials) and I try to set one or two goals each year to work on. This year its coach-ref relationship and game management, last year it was traveling. I know I'm not ready for the "big time" varsity games and thats fine with me as I don't expect to have a full varsity schedule this early. The reason why I'm posting is I had a situation tonight, that I'd like some advice on....

I had a double-header Freshman and JV girls tonight. First game, is well, a freshman girls game. Coach for home team is chirping quite frequently early on, but I'm ignoring him...

Here's your problem.

Don't ignore the chirping from the coaches, especially at this level. Make them shut up. They won't like you for it, but they won't give you any BS either.

[MegatronOSU]

Originally posted by Smitty

No offense, but 3 years of HS officiating rarely makes anyone above average. Are you a regular member yet? I think Camron posted some interesting stats stating something like 80% of officials think they are above average. That means 30% are overzealous. Take your time and realize that there are so many of us in our association who are vying for those coveted varsity games.

Been refing for 6 years (IM ball, HS rec ball before that), 3 years in Portland. Gone to camps, gotten evals etc... While I consider myself above average, I don't consider myself perfect, nor ready for 4A/3A Boys/Girls varsity games. Probably could handle some 2A/1A games. I don't expect, Varsity games with my current ability, when they come, I'll take them. I've seen a steady increase in the types of games I'm getting. I've been treated fairly (in my opinion) and my improving ability has earned me an increase in the types of games I get, which is all one can ask for.

When/if I get a varsity game, I'll gladly take it, but right now I'm just content working on improving my game and working JV games. I still know that I have a LONG way to go before I'm at a level to consistantly work 4A games and that's fine. I'm in this for the long haul.

[Smitty]

What's your name? Do you work promarily on the east side or the west side?

[tjones1]

Originally posted by MegatronOSU
Hey guys/gals, first time poster, long time reader.

Sounds like a Bob & Tom thing! Welcome to the forum. Just going to reflect what people are saying. Get out of there. I always get my partner and get to the locker room as quickly as possible regardless of how close it was, just avoids anything that could happen.

[rainmaker]

Originally posted by Smitty
What's your name? Do you work promarily on the east side or the west side?

Yea, yea, we want names!!

Both Centennial and David Douglas have chippy coaches. Especially David Douglas. That guy is too much. My vote is, BAM! Give him the monogrammed seat belt.

[TimTaylor]

Originally posted by tomegun
Tim, I'm curious about how you leave the court. Walk or run?

I don't run, but walk briskly. Typically when the horn sounds, I make eye contact with my partner, then glance at the table & if they don't beckon us over we both head directly for the door to the locker room.