Coach uses F*** word

[Rar]

"Maybe someone with a brain wouldn't have to have it explained to them."

I was thinking just that as I read your last post. You aren't getting it at all. I've went through what my point to posting was in every post i've had so far...you aren't getting it.

Just read what you say, like that above. You are being egotistical and condescending, like you did to the original poster (which is what set me off). I have nads (as you call them) and that's exactly why I posted to you saying I think you contradict yourself. I think you like stepping on your soap box and prevailing over the "noobies." (which to you is a lot of people). This is reflected by your earlier post that says "I'm getting sick of all the people that don't know anything around here." You might not have said exactly that, but you know which thread i'm talking about. And yes, I make mistakes, that's why I don't like when people think they don't...we all do.

My problem is with your contradiction and your attitude. I didn't say you don't know the rules, I didn't say you are wrong on interpretations. Do you get it now? What started as a simple question turned into you personally attacking me because of your ego. Back to square one.

Additionally, you probably know the rules better than I do, i'm no expert and I wasn't setting out to try to 'prove my worth.' Also, we are all officials here (well at least you and I) so my posts to you are out of that respect. This is a tough job and is only furthered by these kind of sometimes heated discussions. My purpose wasn't to start a war.

I think this discussion between you and I is over with now. We've both said our piece and all it is going to turn into is a flame war that shouldn't be on this forum. I just wanted to get your take on your supposed contradiction. Have a good night.

[Edited by Rar on Feb 5th, 2005 at 06:01 PM]

[BktBallRef]

Let's get something straight. I didn't address you disrepectfully at all. I never said anything offending to you until you referred to me as stupid after I answered your question.

Rookiedude, Snaqwells, and Jurassic Ref could understand that there was no contradiction in my statements. Picking a fight was exactly the reason you posted, because you didn't like the way I addressed Shont.

You've got as much ego as anyone here. So, in the words of zebraman, "Get off your high horse," and smell a little of what you're shoveling.

Finally, I'll be glad to post case plays and Official's Manual procedures for leaving the floor if you like, so that you can understand that the books have no contradictions. Yeah, I was hard on Shont for not following those procedures. But I have nothing against him. Hopefully, what I said will find a home somewhere in the back of his mind and he'll remember what to do next time. I know that when I've screwed up, someone jumping my a$$ has helped me not to make that mistake again.

I'm done.

[bradfordwilkins]

Double T, I've had enough from both you.

One more word and you're out of here.

Haha... really now.

Rar, one thing I will point out is that when you keep "quoting" someone with wrong quotes, it really harps on your credability, some of what your saying makes sense... but you can't put quotes around something and then admit you weren't sure what he said. As he pointed out earlier, the thing that started your entire contradication argument was both something 1) misquoted and 2) something taken out of context. Just something to chew on before you argue in the future. No problem arguing, just don't create quotes and facts that don't exist.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally posted by Rar
I know you were just trying to defend a friend though.

Nope, that's completely wrong. Friendship has got nothing to do with anything. I've never met BktBallRef in my life. I have been reading his posts for the last 5 years or so, though, and I have a great deal of respect for his judgement and rules knowledge. I also respect Snaqs and RookieDude's judgement too, as well as a whole pile of other people that post here regularly- too many to mention. That doesn't mean that I don't disagree with any of them on something every now and then though.

I responded to your post because I thought I might have been able to add something helpful. Obviously I was wrong, in your opinion. As I said, I'll try not to let it happen again.

[JRutledge]

I realize I am coming in on the end of this discussion, but I want to know how you even hear that kind of comment. Even if I heard the word, I am not going to stick around to figure out who said it. I might write a report, but I am not going to give a T. Why bother doing all of that. Sticking around you are looking for trouble. The game ends, I get off the court.

Peace

[BktBallRef]

Jeff, in the two situations that occurred here, the coach confronted the officials as they left the floor, in a manner no different than when a bully confronts a child at school. I can assure you that had either crew ignored the outburst and not taken care of business, it is them who would be sitting home for two games, not the coach.

[JRutledge]

Originally posted by BktBallRef
Jeff, in the two situations that occurred here, the coach confronted the officials as they left the floor, in a manner no different than when a bully confronts a child at school. I can assure you that had either crew ignored the outburst and not taken care of business, it is them who would be sitting home for two games, not the coach.

OK, whatever you say Tony. Maybe that is the way it works in your area. Not necessarily the way it works in mine. I would probably report the incident, but not a T on the court. Do what you feel is necessary. I will do what I feel is necessary.

I do know that if my hang up is whether someone used a bad word every now and then I would have to give out a T like I eat a lifesavers. I am more concerned with the tone and the behavior than some specific words that come out of someone's mouth.

Peace

[zebraman]

Originally posted by BktBallRef
Jeff, in the two situations that occurred here, the coach confronted the officials as they left the floor, in a manner no different than when a bully confronts a child at school. I can assure you that had either crew ignored the outburst and not taken care of business, it is them who would be sitting home for two games, not the coach.

IMHO, the best recourse is to just get off the floor. If you go back and assess a T, all you are doing is adding something to the scorer's book. Is it worth all that to go back on the floor and be subjected to whatever else might happen by not getting into your locker room? Heck no.

Just get off the floor and write a report on the coach later. He's going to get into just as much trouble from your report as he is by getting a report AND adding a T to the book.

Z

[BktBallRef]

That's not the procedure we're required to follow in NC. As I wrote earlier, you can always request that the rule book be brought to the locker room.

In some situations, the T may affect the outcome of the game. In that case, you have no choice but to stay and administer.

[Rar]

"[...] you have no choice but to stay and administer it."

There I even quoted you completely correct with the [...] meaning words came before..so don't get off on me about that . Obviously, some very experienced/knowledgeable officials on here (Jrut and zebraman) feel differently. They do have a choice and it sounds like their choice is to just get off the court. So for you to say they aren't doing their job because they don't follow your approach bktball ref, is wrong.

[blindzebra]

Originally posted by Rar
"[...] you have no choice but to stay and administer it."

There I even quoted you completely correct with the [...] meaning words came before..so don't get off on me about that . Obviously, some very experienced/knowledgeable officials on here (Jrut and zebraman) feel differently. They do have a choice and it sounds like their choice is to just get off the court. So for you to say they aren't doing their job because they don't follow your approach bktball ref, is wrong.

BBR can be rub people the wrong way...Lord knows we have went at it several times...but in this case he is 100% correct.

Yes officials should make every effort to leave the court as quickly as possible once time expires, but as you are running off the court and a coach does what was described in this thread, the officials MUST handle it.

To ignore it is not only NOT doing your job, you are setting up the next crew to get the same treatment from this coach AND the opposing coach who saw what was allowed.

It is not only the correct thing, per rule, but the RIGHT thing. The right thing is usually not easy. Ignoring it is easy so...

[BktBallRef]

Originally posted by Rar
"[...] you have no choice but to stay and administer it."

There I even quoted you completely correct with the [...] meaning words came before..so don't get off on me about that . Obviously, some very experienced/knowledgeable officials on here (Jrut and zebraman) feel differently. They do have a choice and it sounds like their choice is to just get off the court. So for you to say they aren't doing their job because they don't follow your approach bktball ref, is wrong.

R-E-A-D M-Y L-I-P-S!

If you call a technical foul and the FTs could affect the game, "you have no choice but to stay and administer it."

[ChrisSportsFan]

Originally posted by BktBallRef

It makes no difference whether it's the end of the game or not. Your jurisdiction does not end until you leave the "visual confines of the playing area." The purpose of this rule is to allow you to handle situations such as this. Do you not realize this rule exists?

You and your partner(s) should have immediately stopped, went to the scorer and told him/her to record that the head coach had received a flagrant technical foul and is ejected. Then, you file a report with your assignor/state association or whoever and document the coach's behavior.

You can be offended all you want but if you're good enough to accept a varsity assignment, you should know what to do in a situation such as this.

I'm paraphrasing BktBallRef;; what you permit, you promote.

[paxsonref]

Saw a game a few years back where in a subsection championship game, heated rivalry, team A wins at the buzzer on a fullcourt driving layup, coach from team A flips the double birds to team B's student section following the horn. Officials were off the court and never saw it, but the school did suspend him for the section championship a few nights later. Real class act at that school!

[bob jenkins]

Originally posted by zebraman

IMHO, the best recourse is to just get off the floor. If you go back and assess a T, all you are doing is adding something to the scorer's book. Is it worth all that to go back on the floor and be subjected to whatever else might happen by not getting into your locker room? Heck no.

I disagree. In this instance, I think it was a flagrant T. In most states, the ejection carries an automatic penalty (suspension for some periopd of time). If you record the flagrant T, then the coach sits. If you just write it up later, the coach (perhaps) gets only a slap on the wrist.

If the situation happened with one second to go in the game, we'd report it, even if the resulting throws wouldn't affect the game. Treat it no differently if it happens just after the game ends.