Vacating the lane to prevent a 3 second call

[Dogbreath]

I am new to this forum although I have been a soccer referee for a number of years. I watch and play basketball for fun and I am trying to better understand the rules.

What constitutes an offensive player leaving the lane to reset the 3 second count when there has been no shot? Can he/she step outside the lane and just pickup the foot in the lane? Must the player totally clear the vertical plane defined by the boundaries? Something in between? I assume standing on the line is in the lane?

[AirForceDude]

NFHS
This is staight from the case book...

*9.7.2 SITUATION: A1 is standing with one foot inside and the other outside the three-second restricted area. A1 lifts the foot from the restricted area and returns it there without touching it first to the nonrestricted area. RULING: Violation. This action does not terminate the three-second count. The count goes on since merely lifting the foot from the restricted space is interpreted as an attempt to evade the rule and avoid its purpose. However, there is no three-second count during rebounding action or during a throw-in. The count on a player in the restricted area is suspended when that player begins a try for goal.

[rainmaker]

Originally posted by AirForceDude
NFHS
This is staight from the case book...

*9.7.2 SITUATION: A1 is standing with one foot inside and the other outside the three-second restricted area. A1 lifts the foot from the restricted area and returns it there without touching it first to the nonrestricted area. RULING: Violation. This action does not terminate the three-second count. The count goes on since merely lifting the foot from the restricted space is interpreted as an attempt to evade the rule and avoid its purpose. However, there is no three-second count during rebounding action or during a throw-in. The count on a player in the restricted area is suspended when that player begins a try for goal.

Freely translated, the 3-second count restarts by rule when the player has stepped out with both feet, and then steps back in with some part of one foot. On the line is in, although if it's the thickness of the shoe-leather, I usually don't sweat it, personally. And the count also ends when a shot goes up, and doesn't begin again until there is team possession Used to be that 3-second count was suspended when there was an interrupted dribble, but that rule changed a year or two ago, and now it continues. However, if the team with possession fumbles, and then legally regains possession in the backcourt, the 3-second count doesn't start again until the ball attains frontcourt position. There is no defensive 3-seconed violation in hs or college rules.

Those are the rules. There are a number of different interps that are observed by different assignors and associations.

Sheez, if I'd written this in a different web page, I'd get paid for it.

[Dogbreath]

This really helps, thanks. I was trying to figure out why I would see a call one time and not in a similar situation. Your explanations make it clear why.

[rainmaker]

Originally posted by Dogbreath
This really helps, thanks. I was trying to figure out why I would see a call one time and not in a similar situation. Your explanations make it clear why.

We all appreciate your asking, instead of just yelling about whatever calls you think are missed. The most important thing to remember is that no two refs call it exactly the same. But even so, someone can be in the lane a long, long time legally. If the ball is inbounded in the backcourt against a press, and one player breaks down the court but then waits in the lane, then finally the ball comes across and there's a quick 3--oint shot, some fumbling on the rebound, ball tipped into the backcourt, takes a few seconds to recover, and then team stalls to get the new play set up, it can easily be 20-30 seconds. Next time this happens, you'll be the one IN THE KNOW and can calmly explain to your teammates what the rule is and why the ref hasn't called it. That smug certainty is such a great feeling!

[81artmonk]

I read your comments on 3 second violations. I would like to expand this topic is possible. You commented on one player who may be rebounding. What about the other players who are in the lane not rebounding?? Are they bound by the 3 seconds or not becuase their teamate is shooting?? I coach a girls team. I had a game last week where a very tall girl was rebounding and shooting and 3 of her teamates were at the freethrow line just watching her and not participating in the rebounding. are they in violation or are they off the hoook becuase their teamate is shooting?? I was always under the impression that if you are not rebounding and in the lane for more than 3 seconds it is a violation. I was told otherwise by the refs at the game.

[Dan_ref]

Originally posted by 81artmonk

I coach a girls team. I had a game last week where a very tall girl was rebounding and shooting and 3 of her teamates were at the freethrow line just watching her and not participating in the rebounding. are they in violation or are they off the hoook becuase their teamate is shooting?? I was always under the impression that if you are not rebounding and in the lane for more than 3 seconds it is a violation. I was told otherwise by the refs at the game.

Your impression is wrong.

Team control of the ball is lost on a shot and is not regained until the ball is rebounded - IOW during rebounding there is no team control. 3 seconds only applies to the team that has control of the ball in their front court.

As a practical matter coaches generally lose a lot of credibility when they start asking for 3 seconds.

[rainmaker]

Originally posted by rainmaker

Freely translated, the 3-second count restarts by rule when the player has stepped out with both feet, and then steps back in with some part of one foot. On the line is in, although if it's the thickness of the shoe-leather, I usually don't sweat it, personally. And the count also ends when a shot goes up, and doesn't begin again until there is team possession Used to be that 3-second count was suspended when there was an interrupted dribble, but that rule changed a year or two ago, and now it continues. However, if the team with possession fumbles, and then legally regains possession in the backcourt, the 3-second count doesn't start again until the ball attains frontcourt position. There is no defensive 3-seconed violation in hs or college rules.

Those are the rules. There are a number of different interps that are observed by different assignors and associations.

Sheez, if I'd written this in a different web page, I'd get paid for it.

Well, I did write it on a different web page, and I did get paid. It's there to be found for those with a subscription. It also got picked up by some German association and it's in their official rule/case book. For that, I DIDN"T get paid!

Artmonk -- It's noble of you to ask, and smart of you to listen. Stay on this site, or perhaps even buy a subscription to the paid side to get an indepth look at various rules that coaches don't ususally understand. It's always a leg up for your team if you know the rules.

[81artmonk]

I was just curious on the team rebound issue. The fact was that their 6 foot girl was walking from the 3 point arc striaght to under the basket and by the time she turned around to await the pass it was well passed 3 seconds and the refs were not calling it. I wasn't debating the team issue. Just curious about the acual rule. The acual rule that was quoted on this site spoke in the first person and not as a team so I was curious. Thanks for clearing it up for me though. I try as a coach to be as well educated as possible so as when I do talk to refs I seem clueless. at times in our league I would safely say I am more knowledgeble than they...sad to say But even I will admit I do not know everything as my question to you would attest. Thanks again. By the way, is there an online PDF file availible on the high school basketball rules?? I have yet to find one. just as a reference.

[JCrow]

A singing explanation to the tune of Marvin Gaye's, "I Heard it through the Grapevine"......



I heard the Head Coach on the sideline,
"Ref, call 3 seconds on number nine!"
Oh, I heard the Head Coach on the sideline,
Oh, and I'm just about to lose my mind.
Honey, honey yeah.

I know that a Ref ain't supposed to cry,
But these tears I can't hold inside.
Shooting the ball ends Team Control you see,
That makes me stop counting up to three.
The Head Coach could have told me himself,
He left his Basketball Rulebook on his shelf.
Instead....

[A Pennsylvania Coach]

Why are you allowing a player to participate with number nine?

[JCrow]

It was the only number that I could rhyme with "sideline".....

[CaliOne]

Did you see the boston/philidelphia triple overtime game last night? There were 2 back to back 3-second calls. I didn't know NBA refs. knew what 3 second calls were.

I'm not one to call 3-seconds, not to say that I never will. I hate partners, where that is their favorite call, with 3 or 4 per night.