Go Dressed???

[JRutledge]

Originally posted by Redhouse
coming to a game dressed is unprofessional, but changing out of the back of a truck hoping that nobody will see you changing is professional. Humm, I am not quite understanding that one. I guess it is all based on where you call. In our association almost everyone goes to the games in uniform. Our assignor has never mentioned that we should be changing on site.

Redhouse,

You can compare apples and oranges all you like. Baseball is outside played completely away from the school or not at a school at all. Basketball is in a gym where both teams have a locker room in most cases. Not sure that is a hard concept to grasp.

When I move to your area then I will worry about what your association does. Move to my area and you will not work hardly any varsity games (let us not even go there at the college level) if you show up dressed. But let us not start comparing sports that do not have the same traditions. One sport is usually a revenue sport, the other is not. One sport charges money attend a game, the other sport might be lucky if you get anyone to watch the game. Not the same thing.

Peace

[ChrisSportsFan]

Originally posted by JRutledge


The bottom line this is all based on opinion. If you feel that this is not a big deal that is your choice. But understand there are people around that more than likely do not share your point of view.




This is true with politics, religion, philosophies, raising children, vacation preferances and getting dressed at games. I prefer to get dressed at the game site, so long as I'm confident I won't be in the restroom or sharing a lockerroom with one of the teams.





Just a side note. The ground right now is covered with snow and it is raining. I cannot imagine going to a game today while trying to dodge snow and slush. Then sit in a car for an hour in that uniform. Then get out of my car again and hope I do not get things all over my uniform dodging the snow that was not shuffled out of the parking lot. Then go into the game with a clean uniform and clean shoes. Maybe that works in Southern California where it never rains (which is not true, ask the NFL). But in the Midwest that weather is so volatile and you might have to walk through a foot of snow realistically, I would not want to have snow and moisture all over my uniform and leave everyone with a horrible impression of how clean I keep my uniform. [/B]

even if I HAVE TO get dressed before going to the game, I won't wear my court shoes in, they have never seen the outdoors. another thing, if there's a foot of snow, i'm not shuffling my feet.

[Nu1]

I hope I didn't miss this same point or question in this thread, but...

What if you have to go to another game after your game? Do you dress at the gym...do one game...get changed...go to your next game...get dressed in your uniform again??? Many officials where I am do a freshman game or two and then go to a JV game.

Just wondering how those who change at the school work that situation. I try to change at the school but I don't always. Being my first year, I'm still working on how to handle this. I'll definitely do what my assignor says.

[OverAndBack]

Originally posted by JRutledge
I have heard in just this past off season three very powerful assignors make this statement on their own in meetings or presentations. One made it very clear, "You will not work for me if you do that." Not only did they make those types of comments, they also talked about other assignors the felt the same way. You also might remember there is a reason many of the officials you are working with are at that level. You are new, but many working those levels are not new at all. This is not really my main issue. But it is the issue with most of the people, if not all of the assignors I work with and many officials in this state that are well respected. I am just one person. I cannot prevent you from working an entire schedule. All I can do is decide if you are going to work one or two games a year when I need a partner. Assignors can tell other assignors about an official and pass the word around. If they think it is unprofessional and should not be done, I am not the person to take it up with. Now you might be able to work a freshman game showing up dressed or even a Saturday morning JV game. If you do that at a prelim game or varsity date, the spotlight is a lot brighter and hotter. All I am saying is it is not an acceptable practice.

Rut - you're misunderstanding me. I know there's a reason that "non-new" guys will work lower-level games (there are lots of reasons, actually - and not all of them are about performance or professionalism), and I said that I can't control that, nor do I care to. I worry about what I need to do and how I was taught to do things. I was taught to show up 90 minutes at least before a football game, so I do. The fact that I've had partners show up 10 minutes before the game doesn't matter to me, and it's not going to make me start showing up 10 minutes before a game. I do what I need to do and what I've been taught is the right way to do things - not because I'm worried about whether or not some assignor or evaluator is watching, but because I think it's the right thing to do.

I'm not on some sort of career track here - I'm too old to think about investing 20 years in this to try to get to the NBA or the NFL. I just enjoy doing games, and I approach the freshman "B" game on Monday night at 5:30 in front of 15 people like I would the varsity game on Friday night in front of 3,000 people. If others don't, that's cool, too. I can't control what others do, nor would I cast aspersions on anyone else who does things differently. I'm in charge of my preparation and deportment, not theirs.

So I don't know why you're coming down on me and intimating that you'd put the kibosh on me working if you have the chance when I've gone out of my way to make it clear that I don't exhibit the behavior we're discussing here.

Take care.

[JRutledge]

Originally posted by Nu1
What if you have to go to another game after your game? Do you dress at the gym...do one game...get changed...go to your next game...get dressed in your uniform again??? Many officials where I am do a freshman game or two and then go to a JV game.

Something like this would usually only happen on a Saturday or possibly Holiday Tournaments. So for one this is rare for me at best. I do not make a habit of scheduling games where I would not have enough time in between game to get dressed or get to in a reasonable time frame.

This Saturday I have 3 games. I will work one JV game 9:30 am which is about 10 minutes from my house. I have a 1:00pm varsity (doubleheader) game at a school that will take me about 30 minutes to get to from my house. I have another varsity game at 7:00pm that night. It will take me less than 30 minutes to get the final destination. I will take a shower after each game. I will get dressed at each site and back into my street clothes. If I could not do that, I would not take the games.

Peace

[dblref]

Originally posted by BktBallRef

All of the baseball and softball umpires here go to games with their uniform on. The PU puts his plate gear on in the parking lot.

When I was reffing soccer, I always wore my uniform to the game - even at the HS level. Most times, I would not wear my uniform shirt to the game (colors were black, red, yellow, or fuscia) and have on a black t-shirt. When I got to the field, I might have to change my uniform shirt depending on the team colors. In colder weather, I wore a black warm-up suit.

[JRutledge]

Originally posted by OverAndBack
Rut - you're misunderstanding me. I know there's a reason that "non-new" guys will work lower-level games (there are lots of reasons, actually - and not all of them are about performance or professionalism), and I said that I can't control that, nor do I care to. I worry about what I need to do and how I was taught to do things. I was taught to show up 90 minutes at least before a football game, so I do. The fact that I've had partners show up 10 minutes before the game doesn't matter to me, and it's not going to make me start showing up 10 minutes before a game. I do what I need to do and what I've been taught is the right way to do things - not because I'm worried about whether or not some assignor or evaluator is watching, but because I think it's the right thing to do.

I understand that. Of course you cannot control what others do. Nor do I control what others do. All I can do is voice my basic opinion on this issue and it is up to the single official to make a decision. But there are a lot of officials that get held back because of issues like this. I had an assignor that told me to cut off my goatee if I was going to work in his conference. I want to work in his conference so I got rid of the goatee. It does not matter if it is fair or justified. Not everything we do is based on our talent on the court. It is often times the "little things" that can hold back officials. And in my experience it is these "little things" that go overlooked and are seen as "politics" as for why an official cannot advance. When I see an official show up dressed I do not say anything to them. That is between them and the assignor or evaluator.

Originally posted by OverAndBack
I'm not on some sort of career track here - I'm too old to think about investing 20 years in this to try to get to the NBA or the NFL. I just enjoy doing games, and I approach the freshman "B" game on Monday night at 5:30 in front of 15 people like I would the varsity game on Friday night in front of 3,000 people. If others don't, that's cool, too. I can't control what others do, nor would I cast aspersions on anyone else who does things differently. I'm in charge of my preparation and deportment, not theirs.

You do not have to be on an NBA or NFL track to show professionalism. I am young and I can say I will probably never get an opportunity to work the NBA. The NFL is more likely a possibility for me, but it is a very long way from now. The only reason the NFL would be a possibility because we live in an area and I belong to a football association that has current and past NFL Officials in the group. If that would ever be a realistic possibility, I would have to do what is required. And if I want to continue to work varsity basketball, I am going to have to maintain the standards that I do not set. When I gave my presentation about this at the AOA Meetings and IACAO Clinic, I addressed this very issue. It is up to those that were there to take the information and do with it as they see fit. All I did was share what I have learned and what others do and stick by as their personal philosophy. There are standards that are held high even with the fact that we are not working D1 or pro ball. Maybe your goal is to work playoffs at the HS level, there is a standard that not only is expected by officials, but the assignors, ADs, principals expect from us.

Originally posted by OverAndBack
So I don't know why you're coming down on me and intimating that you'd put the kibosh on me working if you have the chance when I've gone out of my way to make it clear that I don't exhibit the behavior we're discussing here.

Take care.

I am not coming down on you at all. I am just making it clear to you what the standards are in the area we live. I do not make the rules, I am just reporting it. If I was telling a total untruth, I would have had a few veterans that saw my presentation call me on it. You cannot control what others do. If you try you will be fighting a very steep uphill battle. All you can do is work hard and do what is expected and someone will notice (if they have not already).

Peace

[OverAndBack]

Originally posted by JRutledge
You do not have to be on an NBA or NFL track to show professionalism.

No argument there. I was making the point that I don't try to do the "little things" you mention because I'm trying to get to the NFL or NBA, but because I think they're the right things to do.

I am not coming down on you at all. I am just making it clear to you what the standards are in the area we live. I do not make the rules, I am just reporting it.

I don't have a problem with the rules. They are what they are. The fact that there are some who choose not to abide by them is up to them, not me (and you know there are those who don't) and doesn't affect me or my preparation.

But for something that I (and many others) do on the side for whatever reason, it's not really worth getting all verklempt over, and I've already spent too much time on the topic as it is.

[JRutledge]

Originally posted by OverAndBack

I don't have a problem with the rules. They are what they are. The fact that there are some who choose not to abide by them is up to them, not me (and you know there are those who don't) and doesn't affect me or my preparation.

I am going to do the right thing in my mind regardless of who I am with. How I show up to the game is only about me, not who I am working with. Just like a coach will pick on one official during a game and leave the other alone. There usually is a reason for that and most I have no control over.

Originally posted by OverAndBack
But for something that I (and many others) do on the side for whatever reason, it's not really worth getting all verklempt over, and I've already spent too much time on the topic as it is.

Someone asked this question because there is an issue about what to do. I just shared my opinion and that is it. We are here after all to share opinions and discuss different points of view on many topics. This is just one of them. If this does nothing but have officials asked the "higher ups" what are the standards in their area is? If that is accomplished, to me this conversation would be extremely beneficial for all.

Peace

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally posted by OverAndBack

it's not really worth getting all verklempt over, and I've already spent too much time on the topic as it is. [/B]

Is that a word auf Deutsch? Maybe should be "oben gearbeitet"? Getting all "worked up" over?

Just wondering.

[OverAndBack]

Originally posted by Jurassic Referee

Is that a word auf Deutsch? Maybe should be "oben gearbeitet"? Getting all "worked up" over?

Just wondering. [/B]

I believe verklempt is Yiddish, but I'm not 100% sure. But "worked up" or "hot and bothered" would be decent translations.

[Hotlink501]

Rut, I understand it may be the requirement for your "area", but it is not the norm for all. Therefor, your opinion about it being unprofessional is not needed nor is it correct, (at least not in my "area"). Our state association does not require anything out of us not in writing other than being at game site at least 30 minutes prior, knowing the rules, and being professional on the court. This does not make your state association any better than mine, nor certainly not any more professional.

[bob jenkins]

Originally posted by OverAndBack

I believe verklempt is Yiddish, but I'm not 100% sure. But "worked up" or "hot and bothered" would be decent translations.

From dictionary.com:

Main Entry: verklempt
Part of Speech: adjective
Definition: overcome with emotion; clenched; also written ferklempt
Etymology: Yiddish

[JRutledge]

Originally posted by Hotlink501

Rut, I understand it may be the requirement for your "area", but it is not the norm for all. Therefor, your opinion about it being unprofessional is not needed nor is it correct, (at least not in my "area"). Our state association does not require anything out of us not in writing other than being at game site at least 30 minutes prior, knowing the rules, and being professional on the court. This does not make your state association any better than mine, nor certainly not any more professional.

The issue of professionalism has nothing to do with if there is a requirement or not (at least it does not for me). The issue is what the perception you give off by doing it is. To me you give the wrong impression if you can role out off the street and work a game. It either looks like you are coming from a game or you have somewhere to go right after. It looks really, really bad. I am not trying to change you opinion about this. This issue is not much different than when we talk about facial hair, wearing glasses, having a certain weight or look. You will find many different points of view on those topics as well. There will be people that cannot understand what the big deal is. Then you will have people that say it is an issue. I never said that this is about a state association. The things we do here have little to do with state associations, it has to do what fellow officials, assignors, ADs and clinicians think is proper conduct for officials working games.

Peace

[Junker]

I haven't jumped in yet, so here's my opinion. Lower level, I usually go in my underthings (full length tights and such), my stripes, and good pair of windpants with a sweatshirt. This way if there aren't facilities for us to dress in, I can find a corner of the gym to change into my pants (keep in mind the full length tights) without causing a stampede of panting women (just feeding my own ego). Also, if I am going to another site, its a quick change so if I stop somewhere on the way I'm not in uniform in public (I was always told this was a no-no). Varsity games, always show up in slacks and a good shirt or sweater and leave in the same.