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thumpferee Mon Jan 03, 2005 09:28am

NFHS

When can a shot count on a PC foul?

jritchie Mon Jan 03, 2005 09:30am

never in high school...

ChuckElias Mon Jan 03, 2005 10:09am

As far as I know, never in any ruleset.

thumpferee Mon Jan 03, 2005 10:18am

A1 jumps and releases a shot, B1 hits the ball on its downward flight or while on the rim, after which A1 crashes into B2 who is positioned for the charge.

ChuckElias Mon Jan 03, 2005 10:22am

Quote:

Originally posted by thumpferee
A1 jumps and releases a shot, B1 hits the ball on its downward flight or while on the rim, after which A1 crashes into B2 who is positioned for the charge.
Yes, but even then, the shot doesn't count; it doesn't even go in. We're awarding points for a violation.

whistleone Mon Jan 03, 2005 10:54am

Quote:

Originally posted by thumpferee
A1 jumps and releases a shot, B1 hits the ball on its downward flight or while on the rim, after which A1 crashes into B2 who is positioned for the charge.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but in this situation, the ball becomes dead when B1 hits the ball on its downward flight and any contact thereafter which is not deemed intentional or flagrant is ignored.

FrankHtown Mon Jan 03, 2005 11:07am

Case Book 4.19.6 Situation C :Both a & b. a) If the player control foul happens before the violation,penalize the player control foul, and since the foul occured before the violation, the ball becomes dead immediately, and ignore the violation. If the violation happens before the player control foul, award points for the violation, AND charge the player with a player control foul.

I think I got that right.......

Adam Mon Jan 03, 2005 11:10am

Quote:

Originally posted by whistleone
Quote:

Originally posted by thumpferee
A1 jumps and releases a shot, B1 hits the ball on its downward flight or while on the rim, after which A1 crashes into B2 who is positioned for the charge.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but in this situation, the ball becomes dead when B1 hits the ball on its downward flight and any contact thereafter which is not deemed intentional or flagrant is ignored.

I believe the Airborne shooter concept says otherwise.

BktBallRef Mon Jan 03, 2005 11:31am

Quote:

Originally posted by whistleone
Quote:

Originally posted by thumpferee
A1 jumps and releases a shot, B1 hits the ball on its downward flight or while on the rim, after which A1 crashes into B2 who is positioned for the charge.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but in this situation, the ball becomes dead when B1 hits the ball on its downward flight and any contact thereafter which is not deemed intentional or flagrant is ignored.

Nope. The PC foul is still called.

Let's say the airborne shooter makes the shot and then crashes into B1. The ball is dead but the PC foul is still a foul.

thumpferee Mon Jan 03, 2005 02:16pm

So, we can Never say Never?


Adam Mon Jan 03, 2005 02:41pm

Okay.
What about this sequence?

1. A1. Jumps and shoots.
2. A1 shoves B1 as he lands on him. Intentional foul.
3. Ball goes in the hoop.

I know we have two free throws for B1, with the ball OOB at the spot. However. Does the shot count?

thumpferee Mon Jan 03, 2005 03:00pm

Quote:

Originally posted by Snaqwells
Okay.
What about this sequence?

1. A1. Jumps and shoots.
2. A1 shoves B1 as he lands on him. Intentional foul.
3. Ball goes in the hoop.

I know we have two free throws for B1, with the ball OOB at the spot. However. Does the shot count?

In NFHS, penalize the fouls/violations in the order in which they occur. There is only one situation where a basket would count on a PC foul, which I hope was proven by case play 4.19.6. I would find it hard to call an intentional foul on an airborn shooter, unless it was blatant. Otherwise, PC foul on A1. No basket!

Adam Mon Jan 03, 2005 03:57pm

Quote:

Originally posted by thumpferee
Quote:

Originally posted by Snaqwells
Okay.
What about this sequence?

1. A1. Jumps and shoots.
2. A1 shoves B1 as he lands on him. Intentional foul.
3. Ball goes in the hoop.

I know we have two free throws for B1, with the ball OOB at the spot. However. Does the shot count?

In NFHS, penalize the fouls/violations in the order in which they occur. There is only one situation where a basket would count on a PC foul, which I hope was proven by case play 4.19.6. I would find it hard to call an intentional foul on an airborn shooter, unless it was blatant. Otherwise, PC foul on A1. No basket!

The case play does not show a basket being counted. It shows two points being awarded due to a violation. You still don't have a basket counted on a PC foul.

Camron Rust Mon Jan 03, 2005 04:45pm

Quote:

Originally posted by Snaqwells
Quote:

Originally posted by thumpferee
Quote:

Originally posted by Snaqwells
Okay.
What about this sequence?

1. A1. Jumps and shoots.
2. A1 shoves B1 as he lands on him. Intentional foul.
3. Ball goes in the hoop.

I know we have two free throws for B1, with the ball OOB at the spot. However. Does the shot count?

In NFHS, penalize the fouls/violations in the order in which they occur. There is only one situation where a basket would count on a PC foul, which I hope was proven by case play 4.19.6. I would find it hard to call an intentional foul on an airborn shooter, unless it was blatant. Otherwise, PC foul on A1. No basket!

The case play does not show a basket being counted. It shows two points being awarded due to a violation. You still don't have a basket counted on a PC foul.

In the scorebook, those points are awarded to the player who shot the ball. Just as good as counting the basket in practice...even if it is not exactly the same in theory.

Mark Dexter Mon Jan 03, 2005 11:12pm

Quote:

Originally posted by Camron Rust

In the scorebook, those points are awarded to the player who shot the ball. Just as good as counting the basket in practice...even if it is not exactly the same in theory.

As a correction to this, the points are awarded to the team and credited to the player.

Also, the basket does not count - these are awarded points due to a violation.


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