It's About Time!!!

[rockyroad]

Just heard this morning that our local area High Schools will be using three-person mechanics next season! WA State has approved it, and (as I understand it) will be using three-person at next winter's State tournaments!! Not sure about the financial end of things - and couldn't care less, but it's about time!

[rainmaker]

Originally posted by rockyroad
Just heard this morning that our local area High Schools will be using three-person mechanics next season! WA State has approved it, and (as I understand it) will be using three-person at next winter's State tournaments!! Not sure about the financial end of things - and couldn't care less, but it's about time!

Could you please send an emissary across the river and convince us too?

[Rickref]

At just the varisity level or all levels? We've experimented with JV/V for three man. Pretty much just Varisty now. Cost isuues.

[rockyroad]

Originally posted by Rickref
At just the varisity level or all levels? We've experimented with JV/V for three man. Pretty much just Varisty now. Cost isuues.

In our area, it will be a JV/V combo of some sort...at least one of the V refs will work the JV game to "help" the JV officials with three-person mechanics...goal is to have two V work both games with one JV and then a third V for the second game...not sure of all the logistics yet, but will try to find out more...interestingly, all the smaller schools (1A, 2A, and 3A) are on-board with this, but the biggest ones (4A) are balking...weird...

[Rickref]

We tried 2 man for freshman, they stay and a 3rd joins them to 3 man the JV and he stays and 2 new officials join him for the varsity game. Now it's 3 man for varsity only. Idea is to get as many as possible time with 3 man. Our smaller schools also are more supportive than the large ones.

[icallfouls]

Rocky

I need to move across the river.

Talk to you later

[zebraman]

Originally posted by rockyroad
Just heard this morning that our local area High Schools will be using three-person mechanics next season! WA State has approved it, and (as I understand it) will be using three-person at next winter's State tournaments!! Not sure about the financial end of things - and couldn't care less, but it's about time!

This was approved a week ago at the WIAA executive board meeting. I have spoken with many officials and AD's since then and there are many ruffled feathers.

Actually, 3-person will be used at state AND at districts. Whether or not regular-season games will be 2-person or 3-person will be negotiated between the local associations and their leagues.

Lots of details yet to be worked out in the long run. Fees for varsity games the next 3 years drop from $48.00 per game (2 person) to $33.00 per game. Lots of officials unhappy about that. Officials are in favor of 3-person, but many officials I've talked to feel sold out by the way it is being implemented. I can understand why officials would feel that way. The schools voted 3-person down several times because of cost. Now the officials will bear the brunt of the cost rather than the schools.

From what I understand, the AD's of the 4A schools that voted against it felt that the 3-year plan was unfair to already underpaid officials.

This is a 3-year trial period. Schools can vote to go back to 2-person after 3 years. If they approve 3-person at all levels after 3-years, fees for 3-person will be 85% of the 2-person fee. Many AD's I've talked to have already made up their minds that it isn't worth the additional cost and are convinced they will vote it down after 3 years. The initial proposal required schools to accept 3-person after 3 years at 85% of the 2-person fee, but the proposal was changed to give them a "back out clause." That gives you an idea of how likely the schools will be to accept it after 3 years. It will be all-or-nothing and other than 3A and 4A varsity boys, I don't think schools feel like 3-person is necessary nor worth the expense.

By the way, Washington is also going to expand the coaches box from 6-feet to 14-feet.

The WOA will have a meeting on August 13 to give out more of the details of how this will all be worked out. It should be a raucous affair.

Z

[rockyroad]

Yes Z, that's the way I heard it all also...should be fun...interesting that they also voted to continue the use of 30 sec. shot clock in girl's games...wonder if they will ever decide to add it to the boy's games???

[zebraman]

Rocky,

I did hear a rumor that the NFHS is considering making the shot clock a part of NFHS rules so that it can be used in both the boys and girls games by states without making those states "renegades."

Has anyone else heard anything about that?

Z

[Camron Rust]

Originally posted by zebraman
Rocky,

I did hear a rumor that the NFHS is considering making the shot clock a part of NFHS rules so that it can be used in both the boys and girls games by states without making those states "renegades."

Has anyone else heard anything about that?

Z

I think it was discussed at this year's meeting as a rule that would be a state option. Apparently, it didn't pass.

[Nevadaref]

Originally posted by Camron Rust

I think it was discussed at this year's meeting as a rule that would be a state option. Apparently, it didn't pass.

You're correct about that. I posted it in a thread where I gave all of the rule revisions that were considered.

[Nevadaref]

Originally posted by zebraman

This was approved a week ago at the WIAA executive board meeting. I have spoken with many officials and AD's since then and there are many ruffled feathers.

Actually, 3-person will be used at state AND at districts. Whether or not regular-season games will be 2-person or 3-person will be negotiated between the local associations and their leagues.

Lots of details yet to be worked out in the long run. Fees for varsity games the next 3 years drop from $48.00 per game (2 person) to $33.00 per game. Lots of officials unhappy about that. Officials are in favor of 3-person, but many officials I've talked to feel sold out by the way it is being implemented. I can understand why officials would feel that way. The schools voted 3-person down several times because of cost. Now the officials will bear the brunt of the cost rather than the schools.

From what I understand, the AD's of the 4A schools that voted against it felt that the 3-year plan was unfair to already underpaid officials.

This is a 3-year trial period. Schools can vote to go back to 2-person after 3 years. If they approve 3-person at all levels after 3-years, fees for 3-person will be 85% of the 2-person fee. Many AD's I've talked to have already made up their minds that it isn't worth the additional cost and are convinced they will vote it down after 3 years. The initial proposal required schools to accept 3-person after 3 years at 85% of the 2-person fee, but the proposal was changed to give them a "back out clause." That gives you an idea of how likely the schools will be to accept it after 3 years. It will be all-or-nothing and other than 3A and 4A varsity boys, I don't think schools feel like 3-person is necessary nor worth the expense.

By the way, Washington is also going to expand the coaches box from 6-feet to 14-feet.

The WOA will have a meeting on August 13 to give out more of the details of how this will all be worked out. It should be a raucous affair.

Z

I thought that you might be interested in how the transition to 3-man was handled in the nearby state of Nevada. 1998-99 was the first season 3-man was used in both the regular season (for 4A [largest class] Boys and Girls Varsity games) and the playoffs for the all levels. At the time the 2-man fee was $50 per official. The 3-man fee became $40. I think that is fair since 3-man is so much easier physically. You just don't have as much area to cover. Nevada has been 3-man ever since. The fees have gone up over the years too. 2-man went to $50.75 for 99-00 and 00-01, $51.75 for 01-02, $53.75 for 02-03, and $55 for 03-04. During the same years 3-man went to $41.25, $42, $43.75, and $45.
I learned earlier this summer that the coaches and ADs voted to return to 2-man this coming season. It is not yet clear if that will happen, since the 3-man contract runs through this coming season.
I don't know if the $135 will be split two ways for a game fee of $67.50 or if the fee for 4A V games will become $55.
Ironically, we went to the 14' coaching box last season. I told our board that if we revert to 2-man, then the coaching box should revert as well. Or maybe disappear completely, like that 3rd official. It is probably the biggest point of leverage the officials have.
The coaches main complaint is that they believe they are getting two V officials and one JV official for their 3-man crews. They are thinking that they will be eliminating that JV official. Of course, we know that things don't work that way in assigning officials.

[Ron Pilo]

Also as part of the 3 person at the state, EVERY official who can go to a tourney next year will HAVE to attend one of the 3 WOA camps held this summer. (Either as a camper or as a clinician) Doesn't matter how many psat state tourneys you have been to our not. Should be an interesting summer.

[rockyroad]

Mr. Pilo...where you been?? Haven't heard from you lately. How's things in Seattle??? And I heard about the camp thing - also that the WOA is refusing to sanction any other camps, so you get into one of those three or you don't work State...should go over real well with the people who aren't in the Seattle or Spokane areas...

[Ron Pilo]

Rockyroad,
I been around. Just lurkin..........watchin, listenin and learnin..........I guess there's another camp added in Battle Ground........Each camp will have 60 campers. I heard last year the Spokane camp had about 20-25 campers and already the same camp has 50 signed up........Good to see the state taking another step toward consistancy.

Like I said, You are required to go as a camper or as a clinician.....Already got my paperwork in.

They are also reducing the number of officials at the tourney to 12. Everyone does 2 days for the first 2 days and all 12 officials work all 4 days. I like that better as then no one gets "Sent Home" after the first 2 days.