04-05 rules cjages up nfhs

[PAULK1]

here is the link

http://www.nfhs.org/scriptcontent/va...content_id=437

[JRutledge]

I like the changes.

The only thing I do not like is really the new mechanic (at first glance). I think HS coaches will just use this as a "b!tch" moment and could cause some problems. But all other levels have this, so I think it will not be that bad. Instead of "listening" to your explaination, they might spend more time trying to "tell you," how much you missed the call. I think this is OK at the higher levels, coaches tend to be more respectful and competent. I think some new HS Head Coach thinks we will owe him or her something.

Peace

[Dan_ref]

3-4-6 Note Beginning in 2007-08, the home team will be required to wear white jerseys and the visiting team dark jerseys.

I only work a few games in Jersey during the summer, so this is not a big deal for me.

Signal Chart Illegal use of hands adjusted from an open hand to a closed fist across the arm.

OK then... :shrug:

BTW Jeff, I use the table side mechanic in all my 3 man HS games and it works fine in my experience. Pretty much similar to my experience at the above HS level. But if my experience is any indication there will be lots of confusion when it comes to deciding exactly what "going table side" actually means in practice, as you probably know yourself from last years mens NCAA 3 man changes.

[mick]

Thanks PaulK1,
Udaman!
mick

10-3-7d Expanded rule pertaining to obstructing an opponentÂ’s vision to include the player with the ball.

I await the cases.

Signal Chart Illegal use of hands adjusted from an open hand to a closed fist across the arm.

That won't hurt, unlike the hack.

[cmathews]

Like Mick I await the cases to obstructing vision rule change. At first look I don't like it...but I will wait to pass final judgement until the books are out.....

[BktBallRef]

Originally posted by mick
10-3-7d Expanded rule pertaining to obstructing an opponentÂ’s vision to include the player with the ball.

I await the cases.

Is this really a problem?

[JRutledge]

Originally posted by Dan_ref


BTW Jeff, I use the table side mechanic in all my 3 man HS games and it works fine in my experience. Pretty much similar to my experience at the above HS level. But if my experience is any indication there will be lots of confusion when it comes to deciding exactly what "going table side" actually means in practice, as you probably know yourself from last years mens NCAA 3 man changes.

I have no "inherient" problem with going table side. But I think that most HS officials are not capable enough of getting coaches off of them when they have to explain calls.

I was at a meeting tonight with a particular conference. And one of the individuals in attendance is a D1 Official. And his comment was, "now we are going to see who can referee." Because his evaluation of this is that the officials that do not have the "presence" (his word, not mine) are going to get eaten up. And the sign of a good referee is when a coach is not going nuts when an official makes a call. Because either the coach realizes that the official is not having it or they or they are going to try to test them. And he went on to say, for HS the T numbers are going to go up.

It was an interesting conversation.

Peace

[mick]

Originally posted by BktBallRef

Is this really a problem?

Well, I guess....
It must have been broken; that's why they fixed it.

Wave both hands at the ball and block the face?
Only one hand?
How close to the face?
How many times?
Hands not above shoulders?

I await the cases.
mick

[Dan_ref]

Originally posted by JRutledge

I have no "inherient" problem with going table side. But I think that most HS officials are not capable enough of getting coaches off of them when they have to explain calls.

I was at a meeting tonight with a particular conference. And one of the individuals in attendance is a D1 Official. And his comment was, "now we are going to see who can referee." Because his evaluation of this is that the officials that do not have the "presence" (his word, not mine) are going to get eaten up. And the sign of a good referee is when a coach is not going nuts when an official makes a call. Because either the coach realizes that the official is not having it or they or they are going to try to test them. And he went on to say, for HS the T numbers are going to go up.

It was an interesting conversation.

Peace

Yeah, I hear what you're saying about officals knowing what to say & what not to say. During camps last summer & during my ncaa meetings last fall the thing I heard most from assignors is pretty much in line with what you heard from your D1 guy: going table side will be hard for some guys and the advice was if you were not sure at all what to say just keep your mouth shut. This might be harder for some of the HS guys to get, but the better ones won't have a problem IMO.

[rainmaker]

It's definitely the most trivial batch of changes in the five years I've been reffing.

But I don't understand this one:

"4-11-1 Clarifies that continuous motion applies to a try or tap for field goals and free throws, when there is a foul by any defensive player, not just a defensive foul on the shooter."

Does this mean that the shot is good, if it goes, as long as the foul was during the "continuous motion"? Wasn't that always the rule? Even for a defensive foul away from the ball?

BTW what other kind of foul on the shooter is there, besides defensive?

[JRutledge]

Juulie,

I think we will not understand many of the rules until the casebooks come out. This was a rather tame year. Not much that really affects the game at least on the surface.

Peace

[Nevadaref]

Originally posted by BktBallRef

Is this really a problem?

This is directly from the NFHS website:
"Rule 10-3-7d involves purposely obstructing an opponentÂ’s vision by waving or placing oneÂ’s hands near the eyes. While in the past only the person with the ball could be treated in such a manner, this change prohibits any player from purposely obstructing another playerÂ’s vision, whether or not he or she has the ball."

Notice that it is not just normal defense, but PURPOSELY obstructing the vision. The hands have to be near the eyes. To me that means right in the face and darn close. I have only seen this happen once in eight years. A player stood behind the ballholder, who was looking to pass at the free throw line, and covered his eyes by reaching around his head without touching him. There was nothing that I could do then, but I felt that it was unsportsmanlike. Now I can call a T on this play. I like the change. Just don't go overboard with it. Understand that the play it is intended for is very specific.

The rest of the rules changes are insignificant. The only one that matters is the mechanic of switching tableside.

[bob jenkins]

Originally posted by rainmaker
It's definitely the most trivial batch of changes in the five years I've been reffing.

But I don't understand this one:

"4-11-1 Clarifies that continuous motion applies to a try or tap for field goals and free throws, when there is a foul by any defensive player, not just a defensive foul on the shooter."

Does this mean that the shot is good, if it goes, as long as the foul was during the "continuous motion"? Wasn't that always the rule? Even for a defensive foul away from the ball?

BTW what other kind of foul on the shooter is there, besides defensive?

Yes, this was always the rule. But, some people didn't get it.

That's why it's a clarification, not a change.

[Rickref]

As was previously stated there are going to be some guys who are going to be challenged by having to deal more directly with a coach with the new tableside mechanic. In our Assoc. we sometimes do 3 man at the JV level. It allows newer officials a good learnering opportunity, I can see where personal communication skills are going to have to improve or the amount of T's is sure to go up.

[JRutledge]

Originally posted by Rickref
I can see where personal communication skills are going to have to improve or the amount of T's is sure to go up.

They are sure to go up. Because officials that love to give Ts will have more opportunity and those that are reda$$ed, will have more opportunity to get upset.

Peace