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Fri Dec 29, 2000, 02:27am
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Ok. I'm not a ref, but this happened in one of my games.
I'm on team A playing against team B. player B1 shoots, i box out and get the rebound. B2 tries to get the rebound over my back, and so i throw some shoulders, as in creating space. No over the back foul, and i almost start yelling at the ref, but he gives me that look as in "one more word, and you're out". But while trying to pivot, i hit player B2 with my shoulder. He starts yelling at me and punches me (well he missed cuz i dodged the hand), grabs the ball from my hands and throws it in the stands. He gets T-d up. my questions are: 1) After getting T-d up, we got 2 FT shoots. Why 2? I thought technicals resulted in one? Or does that depend on a situation? 2) Why doesn't he get a flagrant or a 2nd T for punching? I'm sure that he should have been tossed for that, and for using inappropriate language (you're not allowed to cuss, opr even say crap and damn which i think is pretty dumb in the league)? Also, what is the highest level you guys officiate? Did any of you do D-I college? or maybe some NBA game (summer league or preseason) or even international games (perhaps, youth international)?? -peace out 
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Fri Dec 29, 2000, 03:36am
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OK, Slugger, here's some answers to your questions.
 1) In HS ball, it's always two shots and the ball for a technical foul. 2) IMO, if he threw a punch, he should be tossed. I wasn't there, just my opinion. Highest I've worked is HS ball. I also get the opportunity to do D1 scrimmages at a major college here.
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Fri Dec 29, 2000, 08:02am
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By the sound of your description, there is an implication the game was rough and getting more physical, and maybe the officials were losing control of the game. I can't say for sure, because I do not know what your normal games are like. In what level game were you involved? 1. Yup, two throws and the ball for a Technical and an intentional in High School. 2. Sounds like B should have been T'd for the thrown punch and T'd again for Throwing the ball. At the end of posts, below the message, you may click "profile", you can see where some of the posters live and what levels they work, if they chose to enter that information. mick
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Fri Dec 29, 2000, 11:56am
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Throwing a punch is connsidered fighting, whether the punch lands or not. He should have been tossed.
Also, you are not allowed to "throw some shoulders." You could, and probably should, have been called for a player control foul. Perhaps the official ignored the contact since both of you may have fouled. But then, look at the result! On a rebound, most officials ignore contact from behind if the player with better position is able to rebound the ball without being displaced or losing the ball. Remember that not all contact is illegal.
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Fri Dec 29, 2000, 12:04pm
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Fri Dec 29, 2000, 02:39pm
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oops, when i said shoulders i meant elbows
lolthat game was actually going on just fine, as in it wasn't physical, however the other team was in foul trouble early so that might have pissed off the players. the refs were also making some bad calls and not making others. i should say there were aabout 5 bad calls/non-calls in the first 16 mins (1 half) the thing with the punch, the ref was looking away and taking to the scorekeeper so they can record who got the foul and all that. (i think that was his 5th btw and so he fould out). he didn't actually hit me, but if i wasn't paying attention, it could hurt . it didn't get any farther that that, cuz his teammates pulled him away. but i don't know if the ref actually saw it or not. i think the 2nd one has but not sure..also on the rebound, i thought it was a clear foul, since he reached over my head to grab the ball. because of that i had to tip it to myself and grab it after that.. that was in 9th-10th grade REC game. the teams were based on schools, so everyone from my team was from my school, everyone from the other teams were also from the same schools. and that game was against the school that is our school's biggest rivals thanks a lot for all your answers!
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Fri Dec 29, 2000, 05:28pm
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Was there contact? Who initiated it? Were you put at a disadvantage by the contact? (this one I can answer -- not much since you got the rebound) How many of the other 4 bad calls fit this description? How perfect do you expect the referees to be at a 9-10 grade rec game?
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Fri Dec 29, 2000, 06:23pm
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Hey Ilya! I find it interesting that a young lad like yourself would take the time and initiative to make a post to this board. Perhaps you might consider officiating? Talk to the A.D. at your school. He/She perhaps could help you get started or at least tell you who to contact to do so. Good luck to you and keep asking questions!
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Fri Dec 29, 2000, 07:48pm
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mick:
i can't describe exactly what i did (plus can't find the right words since i'm not american )what i mean is you know, when you do a jumpstop your elbows are spread out. that's what i did, pivoted doing that. just creating space. hell, malone always does it sorry if i'm confusing you... bob: there was contact. he kind of pushed me a little bit in the air, but i still got the rebound. it didn't really put me into a disadvantage. the other bad calls were a lot like this, plus one was a buzzer shot that went through and was clearly shot before the buzzer (even my assistant coach said that). but i liked that call since the other team made it not us also, in the other game, the ref took off one point from us, because he said the shooter crossed the line when shooting the FT. however, it was clear that his feet never crossed the line. he always leans forward on his free throws, and the ref was telling him not to. after about 5 makes in a row, the ref told him "that's it, i take a point off" (well not exactly that but that was the idea). the shooter never put his feet over the line. his upper body were over the line cuz he leaned forward... was the call right that time? or am i right - the ref made a mistake? doghead: i'm actually thinking of doing some officiating when i'm older (at least a junior or a senior) btw, i've been posting here for a while now... usually i ask about things simpler than this that just interest me [Edited by ilya on Dec 29th, 2000 at 06:52 PM]
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Fri Dec 29, 2000, 07:57pm
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Don't worry about confusing me. It's pretty easy to do... without trying. So, what is your nationality? Seems you've mastered the English written word already. Also, it sounds like you just made your body "wider" with those elbows and didn't try to get anyone's teeth, or sternum. You keep having fun! mick
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Fri Dec 29, 2000, 08:04pm
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i'm russian (was born there and lived there till i was 12)
i mastered written and oral already no, i didn't try to hit anyone! i just wanted to secure the rebound and make sure noone takes it from me. but that guy just happened to be around me..
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Fri Dec 29, 2000, 08:19pm
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Keep at it
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Fri Dec 29, 2000, 10:02pm
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Are any of you here from Oregon?
I wouldn't mind giving officiating a try this summer actually do you know if i can do any kind of officiating during the summer in Portland, OR? (i'll be 15 by then )also, do i like need to take some kind of tests or anything like that to be allowed to officiate?thx
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Fri Dec 29, 2000, 10:09pm
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Mark Padgett and rainmaker are there and maybe others! mick
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