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Old Thu Apr 01, 2004, 06:41am
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How many groups/associations that you work for allow schools/coaches to delete (not allow them to work their games) officials?
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Old Thu Apr 01, 2004, 09:16am
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Associations/Groups have no say.

That is between the assignor and the schools. No association has say over that. Each conference or assignor has their own rules or practices to handle that. Or the same applies to the schools that do their assigning. It is based on what they want to do or not to do.

Peace
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Old Thu Apr 01, 2004, 09:37am
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Re: Associations/Groups have no say.

Quote:
Originally posted by JRutledge
That is between the assignor and the schools. No association has say over that. Each conference or assignor has their own rules or practices to handle that. Or the same applies to the schools that do their assigning. It is based on what they want to do or not to do.

Peace
Same here. But Jeff is in IL and I am in WI where in many areas the assigning is done directly through schools and leagues/conferences. While there are officiating associations, they have no role in any assignments or determining who gets them. And where I am, membership in an association is completely voluntary. All you need to do is submit an application with money to the state office, take one or two open book NFHS exams, and work a certain number of varsity contests to be in the highest tier for your sport. Oh, and since they limit how fast you can climb the ladder, be here for a while.
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Old Thu Apr 01, 2004, 10:02am
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Quote:
Originally posted by Nevadaref
How many groups/associations that you work for allow schools/coaches to delete (not allow them to work their games) officials?
Our association has never allowed that. I can only recall a couple of times that a coach made that request to our board and it was denied immediately. We've had a coach/school come to us with concerns about something an official did and we've dealt with those when they have had some validity. If we have an official who is not worthy of working any school, we'd deal with that but we'd never allow an individual school to prevent a certain official from going there. The tail doesn't wag the dog.

Z
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Old Thu Apr 01, 2004, 10:23am
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Post Scrateches common in this area.

Quote:
Originally posted by Nevadaref
How many groups/associations that you work for allow schools/coaches to delete (not allow them to work their games) officials?
For basketball, three of the assignors I get contacts from will honor scratches. No coach may submit more than three scratches for any given season and must renew scatches each year. Scratches during the season are not automatically honored but circumstances may require a change in scheduled game assignments.

As officials, we are also allowed to scratch schools when we submit our closed dates prior to the season. However it is not encouraged. Usually the assingors already know if a potential concern exists.
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Old Thu Apr 01, 2004, 11:29am
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Our association allows a coach to markoff up to three officials in a sport.
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Old Thu Apr 01, 2004, 11:52am
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Re: Scrateches common in this area.

Quote:
Originally posted by N_Stripes
Quote:
Originally posted by Nevadaref
How many groups/associations that you work for allow schools/coaches to delete (not allow them to work their games) officials?
For basketball, three of the assignors I get contacts from will honor scratches. No coach may submit more than three scratches for any given season and must renew scatches each year. Scratches during the season are not automatically honored but circumstances may require a change in scheduled game assignments.

As officials, we are also allowed to scratch schools when we submit our closed dates prior to the season. However it is not encouraged. Usually the assingors already know if a potential concern exists.
Portland Oregon runs about like this.
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Old Thu Apr 01, 2004, 12:15pm
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My rec league worked differently. If there was a problem between a coach and a referee, I would suspend the coach. Therefore - no more problem. Easy.
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Old Thu Apr 01, 2004, 12:51pm
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Texas Scratch Game

Texas' school governing body (UIL) and the state officials' association (TASO) allows high school coaches to "scratch" as many officials as they want, as often as they want, for any reason they want, and at any time during the season they want. It is absolutely the most frustrating, idiotic, and infuriating system I have ever had the misfortune to work under. In addition, the coaches are allowed to submit a "Preferred Officials" list. Some larger school districts scratch all but 15 or 20 officials out of a 300 or 400 member chapter. An no official is allowed to see the list of schools that might have scratched you. My college supervisor does not allow "scratching" in the conferences he covers...thank goodness.
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Old Thu Apr 01, 2004, 12:58pm
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I'm not aware of any provision for a school/coach to scratch officials in Utah. We, however, may scratch individual schools.
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Old Thu Apr 01, 2004, 01:42pm
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Re: Associations/Groups have no say.

Quote:
Originally posted by JRutledge
That is between the assignor and the schools. No association has say over that. Each conference or assignor has their own rules or practices to handle that. Or the same applies to the schools that do their assigning. It is based on what they want to do or not to do.

Peace
We have league commissioners(LC's) in this area of KS. The coaches/schools that want to delete (we call it black balling) officials contact the LC's and then the LC's deals with everything. So if the problem arises before games are handed out, the LC will just avoid all problems by keeping an official off of that school. If it happens in mid-season, the LC then has to swap games with officials to ensure that everyone is happy.....isn't life grand!
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Old Thu Apr 01, 2004, 04:51pm
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Quote:
Originally posted by zebraman
Quote:
Originally posted by Nevadaref
How many groups/associations that you work for allow schools/coaches to delete (not allow them to work their games) officials?
Our association has never allowed that. I can only recall a couple of times that a coach made that request to our board and it was denied immediately. We've had a coach/school come to us with concerns about something an official did and we've dealt with those when they have had some validity. If we have an official who is not worthy of working any school, we'd deal with that but we'd never allow an individual school to prevent a certain official from going there. The tail doesn't wag the dog.

Z
Personally I don't understand the big deal. There are times that certain coaches and certain officials have a difference of opinion....why rub salt in the wound...if the coach wants to scratch some officials and there are plenty of officials to work, then why push the issue. I know that it could get out of hand but usually doesn't. With that said, our association schedules the games in our area that aren't privately contracted. We get a preferred list from schools that are inclined to do so...and we try to honor them as closely as possible. There are also along with the preferred list, the not in my gym list LOL we also try to honor this list as well...but we don't let the tail wag the dog...it just makes things run smoother if you don't piss coaches, ADs or officials off by putting them together if they don't get along....
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Old Thu Apr 01, 2004, 06:01pm
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Quote:
Originally posted by cmathews
Quote:
Originally posted by zebraman
Quote:
Originally posted by Nevadaref
How many groups/associations that you work for allow schools/coaches to delete (not allow them to work their games) officials?
Our association has never allowed that. I can only recall a couple of times that a coach made that request to our board and it was denied immediately. We've had a coach/school come to us with concerns about something an official did and we've dealt with those when they have had some validity. If we have an official who is not worthy of working any school, we'd deal with that but we'd never allow an individual school to prevent a certain official from going there. The tail doesn't wag the dog.

Z
Personally I don't understand the big deal. There are times that certain coaches and certain officials have a difference of opinion....why rub salt in the wound...if the coach wants to scratch some officials and there are plenty of officials to work, then why push the issue. I know that it could get out of hand but usually doesn't. With that said, our association schedules the games in our area that aren't privately contracted. We get a preferred list from schools that are inclined to do so...and we try to honor them as closely as possible. There are also along with the preferred list, the not in my gym list LOL we also try to honor this list as well...but we don't let the tail wag the dog...it just makes things run smoother if you don't piss coaches, ADs or officials off by putting them together if they don't get along....
All our area coaches know that they have no power over who we send. IMHO, it makes them more likely to be reasonable and not go postal because they know they can't scratch any ref that they get mad at. Coaches generally don't know much about officiating... they just remember who made a tough call in the last minute against their team (regardless of whether or not it was correct) or who gave them a technical foul (regardless of whether or not it was deserved).

IMHO, our association does a pretty good job of determining which officials are capable to do any games and our assigner does a good job of sending our top officials to the top games. We don't need coach input for that and we don't want our officials ever feel like a certain call might lead a coach to scratching them. That's just not right.

In my three years on the board, we had just one coach try to scratch a certain official. After talking to him and the official he didn't want, we found out the details of what happened. There was a little bit of fault by the coach and the official. They got together and worked it out in no time. Rather than having a pissed off coach who thinks some of our officials suck and feeling like he could scratch one, he realized that none of us are perfect and that this official was actually pretty good (and human) after all. Now they joke about it and have one of the best coach/official relationships I've seen.

Z
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Old Thu Apr 01, 2004, 10:17pm
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NONE!!!

Coaches have no say in what officials they recieve, with the exception of exhibition games where coaches can make requests to the assignors of who they want.

I've ejected, or T'd up a coach and had their game the next week. Its amazing how much their behaviour can change.
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Old Fri Apr 02, 2004, 12:29am
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For all regular season games, the coaches have the final say on who officiates and who does not officiate. The coaches also vote on who should be allowed to officiate in the tournament and who does not officiate.
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