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Old Thu Jun 30, 2022, 07:54pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JRutledge View Post
But that is not what I am saying. I am not saying allow anything to take place. But in the literature, they said RSBQ is the standard to call these if they are not obvious at least from my state. But again video would help remedy this but that would make too much sense.

Peace
When the rules were changed, the NFHS said RSBQ is no longer the criteria because after years of trying to get people to recognize that RSBQ was actually impacted too many officials were still denying that it was and were not calling the fouls. So, they changed the rules to absolutes based not on RSBQ but observable facts....2 hands = foul, a hand that remains on = foul, multiple touches = foul, etc. RSBQ was no longer to be a factor. Why? Because they have defined those actions to be, by definition, an advantage to the defense even if it doesn't appear to many officials to affect RSBQ.

Some people will still fall back to RSBQ because they don't want to follow the NFHS but the NFHS has clearly indicated they want those fouls called. You don't have to listen to them if your state doesn't want to but that is your state doing its own thing.

Consider this....if putting a hand on the offensive player isn't an advantage to the defender, why would a defender keep doing it as long as you don't call a foul? The do it because it helps then play defense through an illegal advantage gained by the contact.
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Old Fri Jul 01, 2022, 09:01am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JRutledge View Post
... at least from my state.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Camron Rust View Post
Some people will still fall back to RSBQ because they don't want to follow the NFHS but the NFHS has clearly indicated they want those fouls called. You don't have to listen to them if your state doesn't want to but that is your state doing its own thing.
Like a lot of things in basketball officiating, it all comes down to what one's state association, local association, interpreters (clinicians, trainers), and assignment commissioners choose to enforce.

When in Rome ...

Even then, there are some grizzled veterans that go their own way.
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Last edited by BillyMac; Fri Jul 01, 2022 at 01:19pm.
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Old Fri Jul 01, 2022, 09:03am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Camron Rust View Post
When the rules were changed, the NFHS said RSBQ is no longer the criteria because after years of trying to get people to recognize that RSBQ was actually impacted too many officials were still denying that it was and were not calling the fouls. So, they changed the rules to absolutes based not on RSBQ but observable facts....2 hands = foul, a hand that remains on = foul, multiple touches = foul, etc. RSBQ was no longer to be a factor. Why? Because they have defined those actions to be, by definition, an advantage to the defense even if it doesn't appear to many officials to affect RSBQ.
States come up with their interpretations correct? That is a state interpretation that I am referencing. Not saying something that is not the state and that was specifically used when the rule was put in place and has been used since. I would not be surprised if that was mentioned again since I believe a POE is handchecking. Just like the "hot stove" application, that came from our state office directly. You might not know this, but when they put out the PowerPoint, our state adds or puts in wording to address issues they wish or give interpretations. That did not change here.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Camron Rust View Post
Some people will still fall back to RSBQ because they don't want to follow the NFHS but the NFHS has clearly indicated they want those fouls called. You don't have to listen to them if your state doesn't want to but that is your state doing its own thing.
Did not fall back into anything, giving you the original interpretation that was provide by the IHSA Administrators. And it did not say those things did not apply, but RSBQ is to be used (and the first time I can remember them even using this for any foul BTW) as a way to judge when these things happen. Still, the rules does not mean you do not have to judge when these things actually happen, because the wording is "placing" which is very specific. The word "touching" is not used because players do touch other players with their hands and arms and are not "placing" their hands on the opponent. Your hands often cannot go anywhere if someone comes into your body. We are not expecting players to put their hands completely behind their back.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Camron Rust View Post
Consider this....if putting a hand on the offensive player isn't an advantage to the defender, why would a defender keep doing it as long as you don't call a foul? The do it because it helps then play defense through an illegal advantage gained by the contact.
I am going to say this again. I do not officiate in a bubble. The NF is not an entirely different place than where I officiate other-level basketball. I do the basic things that I do at the college level when it comes to judgment and philosophies with rules. I call more handchecking fouls than most of my only high school officiating counterparts. And all those things I mentioned I think about when calling a foul.

Peace
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