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-   -   A Rat (https://forum.officiating.com/basketball/104117-rat.html)

Terrapins Fan Sat Nov 03, 2018 01:57pm
A Rat
 
I've held my tongue as long as I can. I'd like the opinions of fellow members here.

In March of last season, we elected officers for this season. The President for the 2017-18 season lost. He did not take losing well. ( BTW, He lost 67% to 33% it wasn't close) He broke many of our by laws by going to the area schools and soliciting games for a new officials association that he planned to form. But he hadn't resigned from our board UNTIL the schools had committed to giving him games.

Here's my question, 1st of all, I believe we should be a brotherhood, we should support and raise one another up. How would you handle this situation? Some of our members want to work both boards. ( BTW, we have about 2500 assignments and his board took about 100 )

If one of our members works for his board ( at this point we know of 2) Should there be a penalty? What type of penalty?

Does this happen in other areas? We have a contract with the area schools and conference, we were to be the EXCLUSIVE provider of officiating services for basketball. They interpret the contract differently ( NOW) We serve about 13 high schools, 3 of them have given us all the conference games, not the non conference games, 1 school gave the other board ALL their schedule ( 15 games ) because he offered to work 2 person instead of 3 person, the remainder of schools have given us their entire schedule.

I'd like to stay positive, but this guy.....sore loser. Rat.

Rich Sat Nov 03, 2018 02:03pm
A Rat
 
Penalizing independent contractors? Interesting.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Terrapins Fan (Post 1025664)
I've held my tongue as long as I can. I'd like the opinions of fellow members here.



In March of last season, we elected officers for this season. The President for the 2017-18 season lost. He did not take losing well. ( BTW, He lost 67% to 33% it wasn't close) He broke many of our by laws by going to the area schools and soliciting games for a new officials association that he planned to form. But he hadn't resigned from our board UNTIL the schools had committed to giving him games.



Here's my question, 1st of all, I believe we should be a brotherhood, we should support and raise one another up. How would you handle this situation? Some of our members want to work both boards. ( BTW, we have about 2500 assignments and his board took about 100 )



If one of our members works for his board ( at this point we know of 2) Should there be a penalty? What type of penalty?



Does this happen in other areas? We have a contract with the area schools and conference, we were to be the EXCLUSIVE provider of officiating services for basketball. They interpret the contract differently ( NOW) We serve about 13 high schools, 3 of them have given us all the conference games, not the non conference games, 1 school gave the other board ALL their schedule ( 15 games ) because he offered to work 2 person instead of 3 person, the remainder of schools have given us their entire schedule.



I'd like to stay positive, but this guy.....sore loser. Rat.






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Terrapins Fan Sat Nov 03, 2018 02:30pm
Just looking for other people's thoughts.

How would you feel Rich if a former member left and became a competitor because he lost an election?

Rich Sat Nov 03, 2018 02:31pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Terrapins Fan (Post 1025666)
Just looking for other people's thoughts.



How would you feel Rich if a former member left and became a competitor because he lost an election?


Has nothing to do with feelings. Need to show those schools you provide a better product and compete.


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Terrapins Fan Sat Nov 03, 2018 03:31pm
I agree. But feelings do come into play. I go back to officiating shoild be a brotherhood. We should support one another, not split because we lost an election.

BillyMac Sat Nov 03, 2018 03:46pm
Build A Better Mousetrap ...
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Terrapins Fan (Post 1025668)
But feelings do come into play.
I agree with Rich. Feelings and emotions should not be completely ignored, but they should not come into play regarding moving on from this ugly situation.

Show schools you provide a better product and compete. Recruit more schools. Offer to work more scrimmages for a lower fee (if any). Recruit more officials. Improve your training program. Improve your evaluation system. Keeps business to a minimum and continuing education to a maximum when you have meetings.

Turn lemons into ... Never mind. I don't think that you're in the mood for clichés.

bob jenkins Sat Nov 03, 2018 04:13pm
THis is one of the problems when "associations" are also "assigners" and there's some sort of exclusive relationship with the officials.

Rich Sat Nov 03, 2018 04:15pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by bob jenkins (Post 1025670)
THis is one of the problems when "associations" are also "assigners" and there's some sort of exclusive relationship with the officials.


I've always found this to be a huge conflict of interest that always ends up being restraint of trade in some way.

Having one person or group dictate whether I can work and what I work is a terrible arrangement, IMO.


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Mark T. DeNucci, Sr. Sat Nov 03, 2018 04:21pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Terrapins Fan (Post 1025664)
I've held my tongue as long as I can. I'd like the opinions of fellow members here.

In March of last season, we elected officers for this season. The President for the 2017-18 season lost. He did not take losing well. ( BTW, He lost 67% to 33% it wasn't close) He broke many of our by laws by going to the area schools and soliciting games for a new officials association that he planned to form. But he hadn't resigned from our board UNTIL the schools had committed to giving him games.

Here's my question, 1st of all, I believe we should be a brotherhood, we should support and raise one another up. How would you handle this situation? Some of our members want to work both boards. ( BTW, we have about 2500 assignments and his board took about 100 )

If one of our members works for his board ( at this point we know of 2) Should there be a penalty? What type of penalty?

Does this happen in other areas? We have a contract with the area schools and conference, we were to be the EXCLUSIVE provider of officiating services for basketball. They interpret the contract differently ( NOW) We serve about 13 high schools, 3 of them have given us all the conference games, not the non conference games, 1 school gave the other board ALL their schedule ( 15 games ) because he offered to work 2 person instead of 3 person, the remainder of schools have given us their entire schedule.

I'd like to stay positive, but this guy.....sore loser. Rat.

Terrapins Fan:

If I read your comment correctly, I assume that you are looking for a rat exterminator. Since I am originally from Youngstown, Ohio, ;), ;), I am sure that I can solve your rat problem, ;).

MTD, Sr.

SC Official Sat Nov 03, 2018 05:17pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich (Post 1025665)
Penalizing independent contractors? Interesting.
Certainly wouldn’t be the first time, as you know.

BillyMac Sat Nov 03, 2018 06:20pm
Exterminator ...
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr. (Post 1025672)
Since I am originally from Youngstown, Ohio, I am sure that I can solve your rat problem ...
Wait a minute. Did you have access to Whitey Bulger when he was in prison?

The_Rookie Sat Nov 03, 2018 07:06pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Terrapins Fan (Post 1025664)
I've held my tongue as long as I can. I'd like the opinions of fellow members here.

In March of last season, we elected officers for this season. The President for the 2017-18 season lost. He did not take losing well. ( BTW, He lost 67% to 33% it wasn't close) He broke many of our by laws by going to the area schools and soliciting games for a new officials association that he planned to form. But he hadn't resigned from our board UNTIL the schools had committed to giving him games.

Here's my question, 1st of all, I believe we should be a brotherhood, we should support and raise one another up. How would you handle this situation? Some of our members want to work both boards. ( BTW, we have about 2500 assignments and his board took about 100 )

If one of our members works for his board ( at this point we know of 2) Should there be a penalty? What type of penalty?

Does this happen in other areas? We have a contract with the area schools and conference, we were to be the EXCLUSIVE provider of officiating services for basketball. They interpret the contract differently ( NOW) We serve about 13 high schools, 3 of them have given us all the conference games, not the non conference games, 1 school gave the other board ALL their schedule ( 15 games ) because he offered to work 2 person instead of 3 person, the remainder of schools have given us their entire schedule.

I'd like to stay positive, but this guy.....sore loser. Rat.
Not the first time this situation has occurred. People get hurt feelings and they take action. If the schools are satisfied with the service your board provides why would they switch? Has anyone explained the circumstances to the schools that switched? Independent Contractors can work when and for who they want.

From the facts you present, I would agree the guy is the skunk at the picnic but not sure what course of action your association would like to pursue!

Terrapins Fan Sat Nov 03, 2018 07:51pm
We cover 7 counties. 2 school in the county, including the one he graduated from, gave him games. 2 school in another county gave him games. 1 because he offered a lower rate using 2 person mechanics instead of 3 person.

Mark T. DeNucci, Sr. Sat Nov 03, 2018 10:12pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by BillyMac (Post 1025675)
Wait a minute. Did you have access to Whitey Bulger when he was in prison?

Stand up guys keep their mouths shut. :rolleyes:

MTD, Sr.

Bad Zebra Sun Nov 04, 2018 08:38am
For starters...I think you have him labeled incorrectly. My impression is that he’s more of a WEASEL than rat (at least compared to what I perceive as the definition of a rat).

Second, as much as it sucks, the guy has a right to do what he did. I’ve heard of and experienced similar attempt in the past. Always by a jilted or disgruntled association member who has enough of a history, juice, and experience to try to start their own gig. My advice is to let it run it’s course. He may have a little success early from loyal friends or acquaintances. You can’t expect everyone in your association to blackball him or his association...there are bound to be a few members who are loyal to him as well. In the end, the principle of overwhelming force will prevail...you have superior numbers and an established track record. He has neither. He’ll last a season or two.


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