A Rat
 

I've held my tongue as long as I can. I'd like the opinions of fellow members here.

In March of last season, we elected officers for this season. The President for the 2017-18 season lost. He did not take losing well. ( BTW, He lost 67% to 33% it wasn't close) He broke many of our by laws by going to the area schools and soliciting games for a new officials association that he planned to form. But he hadn't resigned from our board UNTIL the schools had committed to giving him games.

Here's my question, 1st of all, I believe we should be a brotherhood, we should support and raise one another up. How would you handle this situation? Some of our members want to work both boards. ( BTW, we have about 2500 assignments and his board took about 100 )

If one of our members works for his board ( at this point we know of 2) Should there be a penalty? What type of penalty?

Does this happen in other areas? We have a contract with the area schools and conference, we were to be the EXCLUSIVE provider of officiating services for basketball. They interpret the contract differently ( NOW) We serve about 13 high schools, 3 of them have given us all the conference games, not the non conference games, 1 school gave the other board ALL their schedule ( 15 games ) because he offered to work 2 person instead of 3 person, the remainder of schools have given us their entire schedule.

I'd like to stay positive, but this guy.....sore loser. Rat.

A Rat
 

Penalizing independent contractors? Interesting.









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Just looking for other people's thoughts.

How would you feel Rich if a former member left and became a competitor because he lost an election?

Has nothing to do with feelings. Need to show those schools you provide a better product and compete.


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I agree. But feelings do come into play. I go back to officiating shoild be a brotherhood. We should support one another, not split because we lost an election.

Build A Better Mousetrap ...
 

I agree with Rich. Feelings and emotions should not be completely ignored, but they should not come into play regarding moving on from this ugly situation.

Show schools you provide a better product and compete. Recruit more schools. Offer to work more scrimmages for a lower fee (if any). Recruit more officials. Improve your training program. Improve your evaluation system. Keeps business to a minimum and continuing education to a maximum when you have meetings.

Turn lemons into ... Never mind. I don't think that you're in the mood for clichés.

THis is one of the problems when "associations" are also "assigners" and there's some sort of exclusive relationship with the officials.

I've always found this to be a huge conflict of interest that always ends up being restraint of trade in some way.

Having one person or group dictate whether I can work and what I work is a terrible arrangement, IMO.


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Terrapins Fan:

If I read your comment correctly, I assume that you are looking for a rat exterminator. Since I am originally from Youngstown, Ohio, ;), ;), I am sure that I can solve your rat problem, ;).

MTD, Sr.

Certainly wouldn’t be the first time, as you know.

Exterminator ...
 

Wait a minute. Did you have access to Whitey Bulger when he was in prison?

Not the first time this situation has occurred. People get hurt feelings and they take action. If the schools are satisfied with the service your board provides why would they switch? Has anyone explained the circumstances to the schools that switched? Independent Contractors can work when and for who they want.

From the facts you present, I would agree the guy is the skunk at the picnic but not sure what course of action your association would like to pursue!

We cover 7 counties. 2 school in the county, including the one he graduated from, gave him games. 2 school in another county gave him games. 1 because he offered a lower rate using 2 person mechanics instead of 3 person.

Stand up guys keep their mouths shut. :rolleyes:

MTD, Sr.

For starters...I think you have him labeled incorrectly. My impression is that he’s more of a WEASEL than rat (at least compared to what I perceive as the definition of a rat).

Second, as much as it sucks, the guy has a right to do what he did. I’ve heard of and experienced similar attempt in the past. Always by a jilted or disgruntled association member who has enough of a history, juice, and experience to try to start their own gig. My advice is to let it run it’s course. He may have a little success early from loyal friends or acquaintances. You can’t expect everyone in your association to blackball him or his association...there are bound to be a few members who are loyal to him as well. In the end, the principle of overwhelming force will prevail...you have superior numbers and an established track record. He has neither. He’ll last a season or two.

Totally agree. I get why this happens or people think this is the a good thing on the surface, but when it is about the person that assigns in your group and that relationship with the group is strained, then this is what can and will happen.

Peace

Bad Zebra, Thanks, good advice. Same with everyone who replied. His stated goal is to destroy our group. He took 5 of the best officials with him. 2 are college level officials.

But we have a very good core. It just bothers me that someone can do this. I would never have thought about it in a million years.

It happened here 8 years ago when a commissioner (assignor) was voted out. Quality of local HS officiating has been for sh!t ever since because of the fracture. It's why I traveled up to Richmond for 6 years to officiate HS games.

This is simply not true much of the time no matter how much people throw the "independent contractor" card around. There are many states that do not allow you to take games from more than one association. There are associations that will treat you poorly for being a dual member even if it's not prohibited. And even at the college level or in states where associations don't assign games, there are assigners who hate each other and will not use guys that work for the other guy, or there are single-gender assigners that won't let their guys work the other gender. Spin it however you want, but that is restriction of trade.

This is all well and good, but at the end of the day this is a competitive, often cutthroat business no matter how much we want it to be a utopia.

I wouldn't work for him based on this alone.

If I am a member of an association and association leadership does this, how does this help me?

Somehow I'm not sure we're getting both sides of the story regarding this association split. Five of the best officials in the association leave along with this person and two of them are college level officials, and we're supposed to believe that all of this happened because someone lost an election?? Seems to me like there's more to this than what we've been told.

Anything Goes (Cole Porter, 1934) ...
 

By keeping school schedules, and thus more game assignments for you, especially if you're not a member of another assigning board.

You're right, it's not a great idea, but in the "dog eat dog world" of two competing assigning boards in the same locality, anything goes when it comes to making one assigning board look more attractive to coaches/athletic directors/principals/league directors than the other assigning board.

And maybe, depending on the state guidelines and contracted fees, it's easier to "tinker" with scrimmage fees than it is to "tinker" with actual game fees.

In the specific case of this thread, the "Brand X" assigning board already came up with a cost saving measure of lower total game fees by agreeing to go with two person crews.

Some schools may find this cost saving idea of "quantity over quality" financially attractive and thus, a real bargain.

Others may not.

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The Assigner ...
 

Perhaps the position of President has the additional role of an assigner, which can be quite a powerful role.

What's the most common argument, either as an "in your face" argument, or a "behind the scenes" undercurrent argument, in the business aspect of any local association/board?

Three answers, in order: Games assigned. Games assigned. Games assigned.

More games. Better games. More higher level games. Less travel distance games. More boys games. Fewer girls games. Better sites. More varsity games. Fewer subvarsity games. No middle school games. No two person games. More conference playoff games. More games at sites where the concession stand gives the officials free refreshments.

Games assigned. Games assigned. Games assigned.

Who controls all that?

The Great and Powerful Assigner, and there's nobody hiding behind the curtain.

We are a board of about 50 officials, the majority over 50, as I am, he was younger at 41. 10 years experience, The others that left were all around the same age and younger, they were not happy with their progress in the association, Personally I don't blame them but if they had been patient their time would have come.

I don't know how this is going turn out yet, but I do know that having to associations in a small area is not good. Not good for wages not good for assignments.

One of the people who left and is a college official, Ran for interpreter and lost to. Another ran for secretary and lost. So there's a lot of ego involved here.

Perhaps they feel that your association is too much of a "good ol' boys" network for them to reach their goals. After all, you say you don't blame them for not being happy and that they're relatively young–common complaints of disgruntled officials. And the reality is, "their time will come" simply isn't true all the time.

It is true that many officials that complain about politics have an overinflated opinion about their abilities. It is equally true that many officials cannot advance for no reason other than the good ol' boys system, and acting like that's not true is just disingenuous.

I am not saying I support them forming a new association; simply trying to interpret their frustration. And again, paying lip service about "sticking together" and officiating being a "brotherhood" is great except at the end of the day, this is a business.

Like SC said, it sounds like you might have ran them off as much as them leaving. If they were good, even better, why would you think it is fair to make them wait their turn?

A college official being held back cause of older officials blocking their progress.

Time shoukd mean nothing in getting good assignments. If the officials are good enough but not getting games because they're being blocked by older people I don't blame them from moving on.





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Competition is the American way.
Numerous successful companies began because an employee became disgruntled with the current leadership and decided that it was better to depart, start his own business, and do it better.

There is nothing wrong with what is taking place in your area. Competition will sort it out.

As far as elections go, I've found that true democratic votes don't usually serve the best interests of an officiating association.

For example, if the group has 30% varsity officials and 70% subvarsity officials, understand that your group will be governed by the 70% who do not work varsity contests. If you elect an assignor, the subvarsity guys will dictate who that assignor will be. Will that be best for the varsity officials?

Another situation would be if an association has 20 truly top officials and another 20 who are second tier, an elected assignor will be obligated to keep as many of those happy as possible in order to get re-elected. This can lead to some lesser officials getting games that they shouldn't.

Situations like the above lead to frustration by some officials and can spur people to break away and form their own officiating group.

Exactly. Wanna know why there’s a shortage of high school officials? Well, one of the reasons is because of crap like this.

Seniority means something, but at the end of the day if your best officials aren’t getting a shot, don’t be surprised when something like this happens.

The problem with tilting the bylaws to give varsity officials a disproportionate say in elections, etc. is that it leads to people being held down as in the OP's scenario.

The longer I live in Wisconsin (17th season out of 32 now), the more I appreciate the value of no association controlling all of the game assignments. I've asked an association to hire for six of my schools (I assign for 23 schools at the varsity level), but we have an agreement that those assignments should be made with an eye toward giving people opportunities. Most conferences here are hired by commissioners who are hired by the schools. Schools typically hire their own subvarsity officials, but many of them have outsourced those assignments to other people. Associations can get involved through this outsourcing and it's a win/win as people gain experience and schools have their games covered.

None of us will be around forever. My knee is telling me that every day. We need to do what's best for officiating and not be self-serving and drive people away. Putting the best official on the best game isn't always what's best for the sport and what's best for officiating.

The more I hear about drama that happens in associations that have assigning authority, the more I wish we had the college-style arrangement that your state has.

They're not all like that. Probably not even most.

And what do you mean like college-style? Here, it is one assignor for 200-300+ miles in all directions that has all of the D3 and NAIA schools and one that has a few of the JC's. College, here, is far more restricted than HS. A person can find 20-30 (or more) different HS associations in the area of 2 college assignors.

Conferences hire their own assigner. That is what I mean by college-style. Thought that was pretty obvious in context.

Problem is in my state, schools don’t form conferences.

Don't Worry, Be Happy (Bobby McFerrin, 1988) ...
 

My local IAABO board (it's actually the elected executive committee) hires an assigner on a one year contract, $32,025.00 for 2018-19. Been that way for thirty-eight years, and probably longer.

I'm a journeyman official and I can't complain, I get a full schedule, including many high level games, usually as the umpire with a high level partner.

I never hear any complaining from the younger officials, probably because of our new evaluation system that does away with years of experience and goes with evaluations by a highly trained committee.

Our assignment system is ripe for problems, in 100% IAABO Connecticut, if one wants to officiate interscholastic games anywhere in the two counties we cover, there's only one assigner, it's a really restrictive monopoly.

And except for those grandfathered in, one can only work in the county where one resides, so unlike Bonnie and Clyde often did, we can't cross county lines.

But it works. We have a both great assigner, and a great evaluation system.

Many officials usually want more games. Well, as they often say, be careful what you wish for.

Last season, due to weather reschedules, during one week in February I worked Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, Friday, and Saturday nights. For the first time ever, I had to do laundry in midweek, or I would run out of uniforms. For the first time in my career I had too many games, I couldn't wait for Sunday to get a night off.

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You're making some assumptions. Your context implied that being college gave the officials a choice of who to work for. Just being college doesn't make that true when the conferences hire the same assignor.

If it were truly an exclusive contract, you could seek a judicial review. He could have be seen as interfering with a contractual relationship. But is it worth it? Here’s the deal, officials are independent contractors in most areas. We do know some of The practicalities but....

If someone wants to work under two assigner umbrellas so what? You can assign whoever you want but are you now interfering with some contractual relationship? Honestly I’d let it go, work hard... show them who has the quality officials and why....

Never did I make any assumptions. My point was that it can prevent the perceived or actual conflicts of interest.

I guess I just don't get your point. Can you elaborate?

What Camron is saying is that the problem persists at the college level too because several conferences will use the same assignor. For example, if the MWC, PAC-12, WCC, and Big12 all use the same assignor and his pool of officials, then you are in the same situation as a single HS association.

Reread the policy Bill. They recently changed it to accepting duals if they only accept assignments from our board. Probably to get around the lawsuit findings regarding independent consultant status.



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Dueling Banjos (Deliverance, 1972) ...
 

Our local board Dual Member Policy (dated March, 2018) is worded as RefCT states above, however, our most recent (Fall, 2018) local board recruit application specifically states that the applicant must reside in our little corner of Connecticut. Maybe once one becomes a member, one can move around. Dual membership has always been a mystery to me. RefCT sounds like he knows what he's talking about and knows much more about it than me. Does a dual member have to pay dues to both his parent board and his assigning board?

Like Bonnie and Clyde, maybe we can cross county lines.

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Makes sense. Poor wording choice by me.

On this side of the country, an assignor may have multiple conferences, but it doesn't mean an official will work or sign a contract for all those conferences. Regardless of how many conferences a supervisor has, most college officials work for multiple supervisors.

One of my college assignors is the assignor of multiple high school conferences. I work for him both in high school and college levels. I work for many other high school and college supervisors too.

I got SC's point totally. There seems to always be some drama that goes around with an association, either by someone in a leadership role either doing something that might be unfair to the group or that sounds like something that violates the independent contractor position. I am so glad I do not live in that situation exclusively (at least in Illinois). If I have issues or the conference has issues with their assignor, they hire someone else or we can choose as officials to work for someone else. I do not work for every assignor in our area for many reasons. It is very much like a college situation where I can prioritize certain leagues over other leagues and work what we want on many levels.

Peace

Yup.

I assign for 23 boys programs and 22 girls programs.

Some people choose not to work for me.

I choose not to hire some people.

Some people ask for only boys games. With rare exception, I don't grant that request as I prefer working with people who will take both. I also remember how much I hated it as an official when assigners would offer fewer boys games to me cause he accommodated these requests, a request I don't make.

Does this cost me some officials? Sure.

Does it dramatically affect my assigning? No.

My goal isn't to get the "best" officials. It's to get ones who really want to work at my smaller schools. I've stopped using some who get off my games too often - a few of those, I'm convinced, dump my games to take ones at bigger high schools or ones closer to home.

That said, I don't keep a black list -- a coach telling me he doesn't want a particular official usually has me respond with me saying I don't keep a black list.


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Intimate Settings ...
 

I like working big games at big schools in front of big crowds, but I also like working games at smaller schools in some of our rural areas. In many of these small towns there's nothing else to do on a Friday night except watch a high school basketball game, so it's the biggest event in town. The gyms may be smaller, but they're almost always filled up with enthusiastic fans, both parents, and students. The players may not be as skilled as in bigger schools, teams often consist of a few basketball players and some football players and baseball players looking to stay in shape, and have some fun with their friends, in the winter.

I just wish that they wouldn't park their John Deere tractors in the best parking spaces in the school parking lot, often taking up two spaces. And watch out, if you make bad call you may get some tobacco juice spit at you. Makes doing my laundry a pain.

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Doesn't he have to get the approval of the state to start another recognized group?

I don't really understand it. I am a dual member and pay dues to our board, but apparently my home board controls all my information related to IAABO and (presumably), the CIAC. I don't pay or interact with my home board at all.

The only reason why I knew about the policy change is I am probably giving officiating up this year and was wondering if I could join Bd 6 again if I chose to ref in the future and looked it up last week.

Unfortunately, working in the Hartford area doesn't make it very easy to get to anywhere else in the state in time for a high school game so I really can only realistically work for Bd 6 as long as I am stuck working in "New England's Rising Star".



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You Can't Get There From Here ...
 

Before I retired from my day job as a chemist I had to travel through the Hartford area on my daily commute. The traffic is a perfect storm of I-84, I-91, Route 15, the Bulkeley Bridge, the Charter Oak Bridge, all pressed tight against the Connecticut River.

Add skiers heading north on a winter Friday night, and those heading east to Newport and Cape Cod on a summer Friday night, makes for a traffic disaster.

Throw in one fender bender, or a little construction, and traffic comes to a halt.

Whoever came up with the New England phrase, "You can't get there from here" was referring to this area.

The traffic engineer who designed this junction back in the 1950's should be shot.

Same ole, same ole
 

Move to DC/N VA, you'll have it so much better...... (sarc). :(

All Roads Lead To G. Fox & Co. ...
 

Been there as a tourist, and agree with your sarcasm, but at least you have a beltway that brings you around the most congested areas.

And don't you have a subway system? It was beautiful when we visited twenty-five years ago, but I hear that it's had some recent problems.

We only have a partial beltway, one almost has no other choice but to go straight through the heart of the city of Hartford.

The I-84 / I-91 junction was named one of the ten most dangerous stretches of highway in the nation in the 1980's.

We have lots of entrances and exits, more than I've seen on any stretch of the interstate highway system up and down the East coast, from Maine to North Carolina, and as far west as Philadelphia.

Left hand exits, and left hand entrances. Lots of them. How often do you see those anywhere else?

When the interstate highway system was first built under the Eisenhower administration, Beatrice Fox Auerbach, the wealthy owner Hartford's G. Fox & Co., the largest privately held department store in the nation, used her political influence to insure that exits off of I-84 at the junction of I-91 led right to the frontdoor of her store.

I-84 literally split the city of Hartford in half, with the north half now one of the poorest areas in Connecticut, completely separated from the main business district.

Like the Berlin Wall before Ronald Reagan tore it down.

Again, the traffic engineer who designed this junction back in the 1950's should be shot.

How did we get from a renegade former association president attempting to found a new association and take his former association's contracts by undercutting his former colleagues in cost and quality to comparisons of traffic patterns in New England and the Mid-Atlantic regions?

AFAIK, unless the new association is registered with (and has approval from) the MPSSAA (assuming that Terrapins Fan is talking about Maryland), it can't take contracts from the existing association on the OP's territory (at least not high school contracts). I don't believe that such things would be allowed in the WVSSAC or VHSL either. I don't know much about how to form an association (other than what is written in the VHSL officials' handbook), but wouldn't a new association registering with the state for the first time have to undergo a probationary period before it can be approved as a scholastic officiating organization? In Washington, D.C., there are only 5 approved basketball associations for scholastic games (Board 12, MBOA, JUSO, Sports Enhancement Officials, Mid-Potomac Officials Association) and Charm City Basketball Officials Association, a new group looking for approval, and any official working in DC must be a member of an approved association. AFAIK, Sean Conley and the DCSAA approve the formation of new associations and oversee their activities, to ensure fair competition for contracts and proper operation (associations can be disciplined if their members fail to act professionally or if they fail to meet obligations to the DCSAA (e.g. wearing DCSAA patches for scholastic games in DC, paying DCSAA registration fees for their members)). Perhaps MPSSAA and the other governing bodies around the area have similar means of regulating association formation and activities (The MPSSAA has a list of registered associations in each sport, and only officials working for those associations service MPSSAA schools).

In WV yes and they denied him. In Md. No. He could work 1 game and he is his own association.

Great replies. Thanks. The contract says we are the exclusive provider of services to the conference, not to the schools, not what we wanted but it's 6 pages of legalese.

Which means other associations can work non-conference events like holiday showcases at a conference School. That's how it is down here because my association does that. In previous years the servicing Association tried to strong-arm the schools into not allowing other officials to work those events.



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Oh man, I-495 and 395 are parking lots from 7AM-9AM and 3PM-7PM. And the metro? If it isn't on fire, they've shut down lines for service. Next year from May-September (read December), they are shutting down most of the services in NOVA for construction.

But back on topic. I've seen this. Dude likely has some valid gripes, but will probably fizzle out in a couple years, and those college dudes will likely move on to doing more college games.

In my experience, the Metro system (Metrorail + Metrobus) works pretty well in getting me to where I need to go in the DC Metro Area (at least in DC and MD). In Virginia, it is a little more problematic, but it has not failed me yet in getting to places in Alexandria, Arlington, or Fairfax County (+ Fairfax City and Falls Church).

When I am more pressed for time, I take Uber, and am able to get to anywhere in the Metro Area in a reasonable amount of time.

While there are stories about weekday shutdowns in the news, and they have happened, most shutdowns and single tracking events happen on weekends or late at night, so officials should have a reasonable chance at getting to games early on public transportation throughout the DMV, at least in the near areas (DC+ MOCO, PG, Fairfax (City + County), Falls Church, Arlington, and Alexandria).

In MD, how can you work single games for schools without being a recognized association? AFAIK, the MPSSAA recognized groups are the only ones who can work public school basketball in MD for the regular season and playoffs, otherwise, MPSSAA would not be listing registered associations. How does Donnie Grey, or whoever his successor in the MPSSAA office react if there is an unapproved association working MPSSAA games? What is his office empowered to do? The DCSAA can fine, suspend, or put members and their associations on probation, or terminate an association for improper activities.