How would you handle this sitch?

[thedewed]

anybody in this thread that wouldn't change the call in that circumstance shouldn't be officiating, are you kidding me? to disrespect a player showing the character to make that admission? It's a bad example of lack of sportsmanship all the way around. You guys think you are infallible? Good lord, this is really ugly, you have to be kidding me. Instead of having a nice moment for all, including the crowd, your egos won't allow you to admit the possibility that you might be wrong.

[LRZ]

Or the kid could be wrong.

I might be wrong on my call, but what I see is the only thing I can go on (besides possible information from a partner). Officiating is an human endeavor, open to error, but we can't officiate by taking admissions or by committee. Nothing at all to do with disrespect.

thedewed, didn't you say that you ref'ed D2? Would you change your call in a D2 game?

[bucky]

One could do this: Run to partner and tell him what kid said. Then return and change call giving deflection signal. Now, it appears as if partner gave you information when really it was the kid. Problem solved....sorta.

Slippery slope - indeed a dangerous term. How many of us have made/changed a call based on info from a player? Happens a lot and this isn't different. In D2 national championship near end of game, FT lane defender points to shooter's foot on line. Ref see him point, moves in closer, angles down, and calls violation after release. Or..player A1, stops his attack/dribble and says player B2 is hurt. Don't you go looking for B2 b/c player A1 gave you information? Or.. player A1 says to you that Team B has 7 players on the court. Don't you start counting Team B players? Or..A1 vehemently tells you that the foul was on A2, not A3 as you reported. Aren't you going to at least question yourself and get the correct player? Or.. how about B2 (#12) telling you that he fouled A1, not the reported B3 (#21), who wasn't even near the play? If you are the reporting official, aren't you going to correct it based on info from the player? Maybe not exactly the same case as the OP but, the slippery slope was mentioned.

[BillyMac]

"Hey mister referee, to be honest sir, the foul was on me (the worst player on my team on the court) not on my teammate (the best player on my team on the court, who, by the way, has four fouls)."

Anybody remember when players had to raise a hand when they were charged with a foul? The NFHS stopped that requirement in 1974.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by LRZ

Or the kid could be wrong.

I might be wrong on my call, but what I see is the only thing I can go on (besides possible information from a partner). Officiating is an human endeavor, open to error, but we can't officiate by taking admissions or by committee. Nothing at all to do with disrespect.

thedewed, didn't you say that you ref'ed D2? Would you change your call in a D2 game?

Hell no that dude is not a ref. He's a Kansas Jayhawk fan who comes in here to run his mouth.

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[ChuckS]

Originally Posted by thedewed

anybody in this thread that wouldn't change the call in that circumstance shouldn't be officiating, are you kidding me? to disrespect a player showing the character to make that admission? It's a bad example of lack of sportsmanship all the way around. You guys think you are infallible? Good lord, this is really ugly, you have to be kidding me. Instead of having a nice moment for all, including the crowd, your egos won't allow you to admit the possibility that you might be wrong.

This is misguided. Your whole premise is flawed, by assuming that the player is 100% correct. This is not about the egos of officials, or not recognizing good character in a player. It's about the correct way to adjuticate a play.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by thedewed

anybody in this thread that wouldn't change the call in that circumstance shouldn't be officiating, are you kidding me? to disrespect a player showing the character to make that admission? It's a bad example of lack of sportsmanship all the way around. You guys think you are infallible? Good lord, this is really ugly, you have to be kidding me. Instead of having a nice moment for all, including the crowd, your egos won't allow you to admit the possibility that you might be wrong.

Nobody wants to hear your Fanboy nonsense. How about you throw on some stripes and you do it that way?

This isn't a site for you to run off on the mouth about what you think officiating should be. Do it yourself or keep your thoughts to yourself.

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[thedewed]

There was even a sportmanship commercial with this exact situation that ran for years. It didn't end with the official saying "sorry, even though you were directly involved and it is against your team's interest to provide that information, and a remarkable example of conscientiousness and sportmanship in a world dominated by the opposite of those traits, I know better than you."

Seriously, everyone on the other side must be joking. c'mon, take a step back. you are not seeing the forest for the trees here. embarrassing.

[ChuckS]

Originally Posted by thedewed

Seriously, everyone on the other side must be joking. c'mon, take a step back. you are not seeing the forest for the trees here. embarrassing.

And you are not seeing the biosphere for the forest. It sets a dangerous precedent to change a call based on what a player says. We have all read sad stories of a firefighter who is found guilty of arson, in his hope to be a hero. You don't think a kid is capable of a fib on an OOB play, so he can later be praised for his honesty and sportsmanship? And has been stated here, the kid may think the ball was out on him, but that might not be 100% accurate.

The bottom line is that we can't rely on what a kid says to change a call!

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by ChuckS

... the kid may think the ball was out on him, but that might not be 100% accurate.

Agree. Officials can make mistakes, so can players.

One big difference between players and officials, officials are the only totally, 100%, unbiased people in the gym, that's why we're there.

Everybody else in the gym, even the table, and the police officer in the corner, has a dog in the fight.

Everybody else.

Officials are on the court to be the only unbiased arbiters of the game. Officials are not concerned with who wins, or loses, but only fairness, and safety. Everyone else in that gym cares about winning, and therefore, cannot look at the game objectively. Players commit fouls, and violations; officials view those infractions, judge the action, and then apply the rules of the game to what they had observed. The rules then determine the penalty.

[LRZ]

Well, that's an authoritative source of guidance. You can cite that to the other coach when he/she wants an explanation for why you changed your call.

It is so basic to officiating--for good or for bad--that you can only make calls based on what you see, not on what others might say.

Embarrassing? To whom? A fanboy?

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by thedewed

There was even a sportmanship commercial with this exact situation that ran for years. It didn't end with the official saying "sorry, even though you were directly involved and it is against your team's interest to provide that information, and a remarkable example of conscientiousness and sportmanship in a world dominated by the opposite of those traits, I know better than you.".

Maybe it did, maybe it didn't. We never find out how it ended.

https://youtu.be/vOhn6eO3Wds

[BillyMac]

In thirty-seven years, I believe that I've worked two, or three, one person games. In the pregame coaches/captains meeting, I tell everybody that I may have to ask for help (from players, and from coaches (on their sideline)), or I may make mistakes, on out of bounds calls. If both teams can agree on a call, I'll go with their call, otherwise I'm going to the possession arrow. Good help. Very few arrow calls.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Maybe it did, maybe it didn't. We never find out how it ended.

Of course the offending team can just intentionally turn over the ball on the ensuing possession, that's the way they do it in soccer. That's one reason why they call it "The Beautiful Game".

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by thedewed

There was even a sportmanship commercial with this exact situation that ran for years. It didn't end with the official saying "sorry, even though you were directly involved and it is against your team's interest to provide that information, and a remarkable example of conscientiousness and sportmanship in a world dominated by the opposite of those traits, I know better than you."

Seriously, everyone on the other side must be joking. c'mon, take a step back. you are not seeing the forest for the trees here. embarrassing.

Wtf does a commercial have to do with anything?

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