Indisputable nonsense

[TopicalTropical]

Watching the Gonzaga game and the Marshall one earlier when the game dragged on forever just makes me sick of the replay system. That indisputable stuff is just BS. It is a coward's way out. For the tournament games there should be a control room making the review calls not the refs on the floor. I just feel they have too much going on with calling the game and they should not be doing the replays. I really hope the NCAA changes things up for next year

[TopicalTropical]

March Madness 2018: Auburn put wrong player on free-throw line to seal win vs. Charleston | NCAA Basketball | Sporting News


This too, let's put a small team of people watching the games that can go over the replays and during the last five minutes catch things like this. They can inform the table before the fts, or waive them off and get the right shooter. We've all seen this in games and seen refs mix up who the shooter is. Sometimes the players are mixed up as well, but even if they are not it's worth it for them to try it which they likely did in the Auburn game. That doesn't mean they are bad refs but that there could be some sort of backup plan to avoid these screwups.

[crosscountry55]

Fanboy nonsense. You don’t want some replays, yet you endorse others.

Didn’t a similar post like this get yanked the other day?

Let’s keep this measured and substantive. Leave the grievance component of your posts to some other forum. Perhaps make more of a summary criticism once the tournament is over and we can discuss reasonably achievable replay change ideas at that time.


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[TopicalTropical]

I am not a Gonzaga fan at all Dude.
The replay system is a joke. Why don't you address my points instead of doing what is all so common on this board and attack.
The replay system often takes way too long. The refs are looking like camera hogs out there and the game is being trashed making it a huge chore too watch when you combine it with the fouls at end of game situations. Did you watch the end of the Marshall game? It was horrible to watch.
The refs on the floor should not be doing the replays for the tournament. What if Ohio St had come back and won the game. What if say that Charleston player had made the 3 and then there was a foul one and one and Auburn sneaked the player on. It would have been way more controversial.

Now, why don't you pick a side. I am against the current replay system and there should be changes. Are you in favor of it?

[TopicalTropical]

At the end of the game, the refs are probably somewhat mentally tired as well. End game, big calls with thousands of fans yelling and TV cameras. Overall they do a great job of getting most calls right. But when it comes to those out of bounds plays, they too often fall for the indisputable BS. Take it away from the refs. They should not be in that position to watch the replay as they have so much more to deal with. Give it to an outside team.

[crosscountry55]

Originally Posted by TopicalTropical

I am not a Gonzaga fan at all Dude.

Never said you were.

Originally Posted by TopicalTropical

Why don't you address my points instead of doing what is all so common on this board and attack.

Says the person who has been a member since January 26th with all of 24 posts to his name. Your false generalization of “all so common” made me laugh. As if you’re speaking from some kind of authoritative wisdom about the culture of this forum. Gimme a break.

Originally Posted by TopicalTropical

Now, why don't you pick a side. I am against the current replay system and there should be changes. Are you in favor of it?

There are pros and cons. Mostly pros. Yes, the Marshall ending was complicated, but those were game defining decisions. I’m glad they took the hard looks, even if unpopular.



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[Altor]

Originally Posted by TopicalTropical

Why don't you address my points instead of doing what is all so common on this board and attack.

Because nobody here can do anything about your complaints. The purpose of this site is to help officials improve themselves. There isn't a thing about your post that helps any reader improve their ability to officiate.

Shut it down.

[TopicalTropical]

you said fanboy nonsense right after my post instead of addressing my point

[crosscountry55]

Originally Posted by TopicalTropical

you said fanboy nonsense right after my post instead of addressing my point

You misconstrue the definition of “fanboy.” This is a clear indication of an inexperienced forum member.


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[TopicalTropical]

There you go again.
I've been posting lot longer than you despite what the current date says.

My criticism of the replay system and officials is absolutely connected to officiating. It is a valid topic of discussion and it should be addressed. What if Ohio St had come back and won the game? Just like the Charleston game the topic the readers would be seeing is how the refs screwed up.


So this is valid but my post isn't?
https://forum.officiating.com/basket...advancing.html

Because nobody here can do anything about your complaints. The purpose of this site is to help officials improve themselves. There isn't a thing about your post that helps any reader improve their ability to officiate.

Let's change things up. With the replays and end of games and fouling. I think it will help officials and the game. I might be wrong, but let's try some changes and see how it goes. Kind of like how the NIT is experimenting.
https://forum.officiating.com/basket...eds-fixed.html
Zach Lowe on The Basketball Tournament's innovative end-of-game rule

[deecee]

Says the guy with 28 posts.

I personally think replay has made most sports worse off due to their awful delays and most of the time not really changing anything.

[thedewed]

The Michigan Houston game was a mess, too many mistakes to count. Early, an out of bounds where Michigan goes over a Houston player on a rebound and as you see much of time, the Michigan guy hits the Houston guy's hand, so it should be out on Michigan, the outside rebounder, or a foul on him, and of course, they give it to Michigan. Particularly important these days, I guess, that instead of passing on the contact and just giving the ball to the inside rebounder, you have to call the foul if in the last minute or 2, because they will review, and can't turn it into a foul, so you can't pass on the contact and just give inside rebounder the possession.

At least 10 really wrong calls in this game, no dog in the hunt, but in the last minute to take the cake, an out of bounds review where a Houston player gathered the ball and fell out of bounds. Absolutely no question who it was out on, WHY REVIEW? The game was painful to watch from an officiating perspective, both ways, many block/charges called the wrong way, basically everything in the book. TOO MANY WHISTLES as well, 'and ones' where you had to watch the replay to see if there was any contact whatsoever.

Call what matters. A sign of a good to great official is someone that knows how to hold the whistle, see the entire play, and only blow the whistle when it creates an advantage. Another way they added to the whistle count, rebounding fouls where the 'fouled' team got the rebound with no interruption of flow. DON'T BLOW THE WHISTLE.

Rant over. NBA seems to have it figured out far better than the NCAA. I guess it's because they are full-time and get paid more? It is a huge gap.

I wrote this before finishing the game, the same official that had to review whether the ball was out of bounds on a player that possessed it and fell out of bounds passed on a clear travel on the last play of the game before the winning 3. I mean clear as day travel, right in front of him. Nice shot though.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by TopicalTropical

I am not a Gonzaga fan at all Dude.
The replay system is a joke. Why don't you address my points instead of doing what is all so common on this board and attack.
The replay system often takes way too long. The refs are looking like camera hogs out there and the game is being trashed making it a huge chore too watch when you combine it with the fouls at end of game situations. Did you watch the end of the Marshall game? It was horrible to watch.
The refs on the floor should not be doing the replays for the tournament. What if Ohio St had come back and won the game. What if say that Charleston player had made the 3 and then there was a foul one and one and Auburn sneaked the player on. It would have been way more controversial.

Now, why don't you pick a side. I am against the current replay system and there should be changes. Are you in favor of it?

So another one of these threads were somebody's complaining about the rules and think somebody in here is going to change it?

All these threads are for is so somebody can agree with you.

What advice do you have for officials to make them better with the rules that are currently in place?

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[crosscountry55]

Originally Posted by TopicalTropical

There you go again.
I've been posting lot longer than you despite what the current date says.

If true, that means you have been banned in the past and have now reincarnated under a different user name. Credibility = shot.

Originally Posted by TopicalTropical

My criticism of the replay system and officials is absolutely connected to officiating. It is a valid topic of discussion and it should be addressed. What if Ohio St had come back and won the game? Just like the Charleston game the topic the readers would be seeing is how the refs screwed up.


So this is valid but my post isn't?
https://forum.officiating.com/basket...advancing.html

Because nobody here can do anything about your complaints. The purpose of this site is to help officials improve themselves. There isn't a thing about your post that helps any reader improve their ability to officiate..

Your post is fine, but don't expect it to get much traction. As Altor and Raymond said, people come here to talk about judgment, play calling, mechanics, rules, and from time to time other officials and their advancements, mistakes, etc. Your topic is more for the rules and competition committees. Whatever replay rules they ultimately dictate, we'll officiate accordingly. You might find a few folks on this forum who want to discuss this topic with you, but I don't think it will be many, and any that do will probably not post much after March (funny how that works that way).

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by thedewed

At least 10 really wrong calls in this game, no dog in the hunt, but in the last minute to take the cake, an out of bounds review where a Houston player gathered the ball and fell out of bounds. Absolutely no question who it was out on, WHY REVIEW? The game was painful to watch from an officiating perspective, both ways, many block/charges called the wrong way, basically everything in the book. TOO MANY WHISTLES as well, 'and ones' where you had to watch the replay to see if there was any contact whatsoever.

I had a dog in the fight. I am a huge Michigan fan. If you are surprised by 10 fouls being called are missed in a game, then you have never been an official on any level. In a 40 minute game all the out of bounds plays, potential fouls and potential violations, the ones you call and the ones you never call, that is actually rather light of a number. You realize almost every second of the game there is a potential call in basketball and you will miss some things. And from what I saw from the bar, I had little issues with many of the calls either way. It was a game that required a lot of decisions.

Originally Posted by thedewed

Call what matters. A sign of a good to great official is someone that knows how to hold the whistle, see the entire play, and only blow the whistle when it creates an advantage. Another way they added to the whistle count, rebounding fouls where the 'fouled' team got the rebound with no interruption of flow. DON'T BLOW THE WHISTLE.

You obviously have not watched many NCAA videos lately. If you had, then you would not have this position if you were at all knowledgable. Many of the calls that were made that I saw were what was asked of the officials to call from beginning to the end of the game that also might not directly influence the play. A lot of unnecessary contact was taking place that have been on NCAA In-Season Training tapes all season and seasons before.

Originally Posted by thedewed

Rant over. NBA seems to have it figured out far better than the NCAA. I guess it's because they are full-time and get paid more? It is a huge gap.

You also have a much smaller staff, fewer supervisors and fewer teams. And you have more of a centralized philosophy. Even in replay not every conference handled those situations the same.

Originally Posted by thedewed

I wrote this before finishing the game, the same official that had to review whether the ball was out of bounds on a player that possessed it and fell out of bounds passed on a clear travel on the last play of the game before the winning 3. I mean clear as day travel, right in front of him. Nice shot though.

First of all, this is what the fans wanted. We have HD video now where every little touch can be seen. So now if someone is going home and a call shows a slight touch, then the officials feel compelled to review. If they do not review the sitaution and it changed the game then people like you would be on social media telling them "How in the world did they not review that play?" The rule says that in the last 2 minutes they can review out of bounds plays, so they review them when they are close. I do not know what you are surprised by. You are the kind of people that got us here. You are talking about plays that were wrong as you had the opportunity for video replay or see the play from multiple angles.

I was just at the State Finals in Illinois watching the game from the stands. I sit with nothing but officials for the most part. Every call is talked about, good bad or ugly. Every situation is discussed. Then we see the video we have an opinion. Then we talk to the actual official and that changes the perspective as well. There were many calls that it made more sense when the official in question told us what they saw or why they did not call or called something. I doubt in anyone's case we actually talked to the official about any particular call in detail.

And once again, none of us here can control anything with the NCAA system. All it is at the end of the day is noise. We might feed into it for a little while, but we do not change it. We are mostly here to figure out how to deal with plays and rules and situations from an officiating standpoint. We do not write, create or dictate what rules are made or changed to. Sorry, you will have to complain about that to someone else if you want it to go anywhere. And something tells me they will not care to listen either. They hardly listen to media people, what the hell makes you think they are going to listen to someone that has no direct connection to the game or those rules commitees?

Peace