Spin move - Girls Basketball (Video)

[JRutledge]

Peace

[Scrapper1]

Obvious travel, which is never called. So it's understandable that the officials don't get it. No foul on the rebound.

[bob jenkins]

Agreed with Scrapper.

[Kelvin green]

It was a travel..... it was not a foul....

[Pantherdreams]

Under that rule set its a travel.

(Not that is matters but NCAA and high school rule sets in USA only rule sets where it is still technically a travel.)

Didn't see a foul on rebound.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Pantherdreams

Under that rule set its a travel.

(Not that is matters but NCAA and high school rule sets in USA only rule sets where it is still technically a travel.)

Didn't see a foul on rebound.

And that may be true, but this is also where the game was established for the most part.

Peace

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by Pantherdreams

(Not that is matters but NCAA and high school rule sets in USA only rule sets where it is still technically a travel.)

What is the wording in other rules sets that makes this legal? (I'm not doubting you; I'm just curious)

[Scrapper1]

Originally Posted by Pantherdreams

(Not that is matters but NCAA and high school rule sets in USA only rule sets where it is still technically a travel.)

I honestly hope this doesn't sound like I'm being a jerk, but what other rule sets -- plural -- are there? I only know of NBA, and they haven't called traveling the same as the rest of the world in 50 years.

Now that I think about it, I suppose technically FIBA rules are in the USA, since the USA does send international teams into competition. But I think their travel rule is the same as NCAA, isn't it?

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

Peace

I know I am late jumping into the discussion, but whether one judges this to be a Travel is determined by when (and in what manner) one judges the dribble to have ended. Keep in mind that the entire spin move ending with the release of the Ball by B5 for her FGA was just under one second.

When I first viewed the play I judged it to be not a Travel. I judged B5 to have ended her Dribbler to have ended her Dribble when she simultaneously touched the Ball with both hands.

Her spin moves starts after 0:23 of the video and ends with her releasing the ball before 0:25 of the video. B5's spin move is extremely fast. (And I had to left click on the mouse quickly to be able to stop action the video.)

The question is: Did she end her Dribble by simultaneously touched the Ball with both hands when A) her left foot was in contact with the Floor or, B) after lifting her left foot off the Floor and either: i) while both of her feet were off the Floor or ii) when her right foot had just made contact with the Floor?

I would be willing to bet dollars to donuts that a poll would show the answers to be evenly divided between Bi and Bii.

But my more pressing concern is that I believe that the T should have been much closer to the play; I would have liked to have seen him Closing Down on the play. There was no way that the C was going to get a good look at the play because there were too many players blocking his view.

Just my humble opinion.

MTD, Sr.

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

The question is: Did she end her Dribble by simultaneously touched the Ball with both hands when A) her left foot was in contact with the Floor or, B) after lifting her left foot off the Floor and either: i) while both of her feet were off the Floor or ii) when her right foot had just made contact with the Floor?

That's not the right question because the dribble ended before that -- certainly by the time she is cupping the ball against her side with the left foot clearly on the floor -- you can see that at 23 seconds.

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

That's not the right question because the dribble ended before that -- certainly by the time she is cupping the ball against her side with the left foot clearly on the floor -- you can see that at 23 seconds.

Bob:

That is a valid point. If in one's judgement one believes that the Dribble ended with B5 "cupping" the Ball against side of her torso, then I would agree with a Travel. I believe that it is difficult to tell from the video. I think that you would agree that one of three things, that you and I have mentioned, happened before B5 released the Ball on her FGA. So the result of my poll would then be evenly divided among three possible outcomes.

That is why I had concerns about the T not Closing Down to get a better (and closer) look at B5's actions.

MTD, Sr.

[Zoochy]

Mark,
So let's just say you are not calling a travel violation because B5 has not controlled the ball until she grabs it with two hands. What if the defender fouls her during the spin? Is this a continuation foul???

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by Zoochy

Mark,
So let's just say you are not calling a travel violation because B5 has not controlled the ball until she grabs it with two hands. What if the defender fouls her during the spin? Is this a continuation foul???

1) There is no such thing as a "continuation foul".

2a) Bob has brought up a could point: When did B5 stop her dribble?

2b) Between Bob and me there are four possible points in her spin move where B5 could be judged to have ended her Dribble.

2c) Bob is younger than me and has better eye sight. In his judgement B5 ended her Dibble by cupping the Ball with her right hand against the right side of her torso while her left foot is in contact with the Floor. I agree with Bob that B5's foot work after she stopped her Dribble by cupping the Ball to her torso and before she released the Ball for a FGA constitutes a Traveling Violation.

3a) I am old and my eye sight is not as good as that young whippersnapper Bob's eyesight, . Based upon viewing of the video I do not have B5 committing a Travel Violation because of when and how she ended her Dribble.

3b) B5 gained Player Control of the Ball when she caught the Pass from B4. She maintained PC of the Ball until she released the Ball for a FGA. B5's Act of Shooting began when she ended her dribble and the Act of Shooting did not end until B5 returned to the Floor after releasing the Ball for the FGA. Therefore, if a Player from Team A had fouled B5 at any point after she ended her Dribble and before she returned to the Floor after releasing the Ball for the FGA, B5 would have been fouled in the Act of shooting.

But I want to reiterate, that from the moment that B5 started her spin to the moment that she released the Ball for her FGA, no more than 1.5 seconds, maybe less (I am leaning toward less, maybe barely one second). And an official has to make a decision as to where and how B5 stopped her Dribble based upon what an Player whose motion took less than a second. That is why I have no problem with Bob having a Travel Violation and another official have no Travel Violation. The players are just getting too darn quick. LOL!

MTD, Sr.