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  #16 (permalink)  
Old Tue Feb 20, 2018, 11:42am
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Originally Posted by Raymond View Post
As it should be. But folks who think diversity considerations should be ignored are living in a bubble and ignoring history. As I said elsewhere on social media, there are currently state tournament officials in every state whose resumes have benefitted from the failure of females and minorities getting equal opportunities at some point in their careers.

Oh, I know. And quite a few who benefit from that would be easily passed over if the process was color- or gender-blind.

Not much I can do about that.

But I have realized that being selected for these things means less to me than it used to. Being selected often has little to do with being among the best.


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  #17 (permalink)  
Old Tue Feb 20, 2018, 12:40pm
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It always amazes me when male officials complain about females getting a shot when those same officials raise no qualms about the fact that it is all but impossible to get hired on a men’s college staff as a woman.

Then all of a sudden when the women’s side gives preferential treatment to, you know, women, it’s some sort of major injustice.
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  #18 (permalink)  
Old Tue Feb 20, 2018, 01:13pm
CJP CJP is offline
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Originally Posted by Nevadaref View Post
Selecting people for crews because of gender, race, height, lack of hair, or any other reason besides the quality of the individual's officiating is wrong.
Unfortunately, you have taken the mistaken path of fulfilling an agenda.
This type of stuff doesn't help officiating and needs to stop.
"Now their high school and college playing days are over, but they’re still on the same stage they enjoyed as players, working five, six, sometimes even seven games a week for the local Potomac Valley Board. All three have worked girls and boys junior varsity and varsity games."

I would say they are qualified and were not hired because they are women.
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  #19 (permalink)  
Old Tue Feb 20, 2018, 03:26pm
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Originally Posted by CJP View Post
"Now their high school and college playing days are over, but they’re still on the same stage they enjoyed as players, working five, six, sometimes even seven games a week for the local Potomac Valley Board. All three have worked girls and boys junior varsity and varsity games."

I would say they are qualified and were not hired because they are women.
While they may be qualified, nothing about that quote will tell you if they are or are not.
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  #20 (permalink)  
Old Tue Feb 20, 2018, 03:42pm
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Originally Posted by CJP View Post
"Now their high school and college playing days are over, but they’re still on the same stage they enjoyed as players, working five, six, sometimes even seven games a week for the local Potomac Valley Board. All three have worked girls and boys junior varsity and varsity games."

I would say they are qualified and were not hired because they are women.
They have worked lower level games for 3 to 7 years and have gone to camps. They worked this game perfectly. This was a lower level Varsity assignment. Next season I have no doubt they will work ( as a crew) A mid level assignment and do it well.

As they progress, they will get better assignments both as individuals and as a crew. I would not be surprised to see them working a boys Varsity game as an all female crew and it would make me proud.
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  #21 (permalink)  
Old Tue Feb 20, 2018, 04:31pm
CJP CJP is offline
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Originally Posted by Camron Rust View Post
While they may be qualified, nothing about that quote will tell you if they are or are not.
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Originally Posted by Nevadaref View Post
Selecting people for crews because of gender, race, height, lack of hair, or any other reason besides the quality of the individual's officiating is wrong.
Unfortunately, you have taken the mistaken path of fulfilling an agenda.
This type of stuff doesn't help officiating and needs to stop
.
Camron, does anything in the original story tell you that there is an agenda here? I would say that is a far bigger stretch than my statement that the officials being discussed are qualified to work this game because they have years of experience.
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  #22 (permalink)  
Old Tue Feb 20, 2018, 04:36pm
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Originally Posted by Terrapins Fan View Post
They have worked lower level games for 3 to 7 years and have gone to camps. They worked this game perfectly. This was a lower level Varsity assignment. Next season I have no doubt they will work ( as a crew) A mid level assignment and do it well.

As they progress, they will get better assignments both as individuals and as a crew. I would not be surprised to see them working a boys Varsity game as an all female crew and it would make me proud.
It is great to see people advance. I personally do not have a problem getting games but I would love to see more fresh blood working games. I do my best to recruit new officials (male and female) but it is hard to get them and even harder to keep them.
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  #23 (permalink)  
Old Tue Feb 20, 2018, 04:42pm
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Originally Posted by CJP View Post
Camron, does anything in the original story tell you that there is an agenda here? I would say that is a far bigger stretch than my statement that the officials being discussed are qualified to work this game because they have years of experience.
I didn't read the original story. I'm just commenting on a single statement that you seem to be saying was something that verified their ability.

I have no reason to question their abilities in either direction.
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  #24 (permalink)  
Old Tue Feb 20, 2018, 04:50pm
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Originally Posted by Camron Rust View Post
I didn't read the original story. I'm just commenting on a single statement that you seem to be saying was something that verified their ability.

I have no reason to question their abilities in either direction.
Quote:
Originally Posted by CJP View Post
"Now their high school and college playing days are over, but they’re still on the same stage they enjoyed as players, working five, six, sometimes even seven games a week for the local Potomac Valley Board. All three have worked girls and boys junior varsity and varsity games."
I don't understand the problem you seem to have. I think they were qualified to work this game together since, you know, they work up to 7 games a week (including varsity) games already.
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  #25 (permalink)  
Old Tue Feb 20, 2018, 04:55pm
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Originally Posted by Camron Rust View Post
I didn't read the original story. I'm just commenting on a single statement that you seem to be saying was something that verified their ability.

I have no reason to question their abilities in either direction.
Why didn't you comment in response to post #2? That is stretching some things. The statement in #2 says more.
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  #26 (permalink)  
Old Tue Feb 20, 2018, 04:55pm
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Originally Posted by Terrapins Fan View Post
When I became board secretary 4 years ago, There were no female officials work in varsity games. My goal was to push our female officials to that level and now I pushed for them to be an all female crew.

I couldn't be more proud of where they are I know the future is very bright for all 3 of them. And I hope to bring in more female officials into the association.

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Originally Posted by CJP View Post
Camron, does anything in the original story tell you that there is an agenda here? I would say that is a far bigger stretch than my statement that the officials being discussed are qualified to work this game because they have years of experience.
Yes, the OP directly states that he had an agenda to fulfill in making this happen.

I have no issue with qualified individuals working any contest. The problem occurs when people put other factors into selecting officials or crews as was clearly done in this case. Where TF and I disagree is that he went out of his way to have all three of them on a crew together in order to make a spectacle out of it. I would rather see them work the games and be assigned exactly as the rest of the members in the group without the extra fanfare.

I don't agree with promoting or showcasing one type of person over another in any circumstance simply because of the way that the individual was born. People who do so often think that they are helping, but they are actually hurting our society.
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  #27 (permalink)  
Old Tue Feb 20, 2018, 05:12pm
CJP CJP is offline
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Originally Posted by Nevadaref View Post
Yes, the OP directly states that he had an agenda to fulfill in making this happen.

I have no issue with qualified individuals working any contest. The problem occurs when people put other factors into selecting officials or crews as was clearly done in this case. Where TF and I disagree is that he went out of his way to have all three of them on a crew together in order to make a spectacle out of it. I would rather see them work the games and be assigned exactly as the rest of the members in the group without the extra fanfare.

I don't agree with promoting or showcasing one type of person over another in any circumstance simply because of the way that the individual was born. People who do so often think that they are helping, but they are actually hurting our society.
I think you are stretching things a bit. I read it and never thought twice that there was some "affirmative action" taking place or a spectacle. I think it is a good thing. Maybe seeing a crew of women working games will encourage other women to get into officiating. Finding officials is hard enough in some areas. Lets double the pool of prospects.
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  #28 (permalink)  
Old Tue Feb 20, 2018, 05:13pm
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I have no doubt that there are boards who pushed young tall thin clean shaven officials to get to the varsity level.

I see that all the time period where they have the skills or not they are young, tall, thin and clean shaven.

These girls work their way up from the bottom to where they are and they will continue to advance.

Yes I wanted women working varsity level games. But they are qualified women. Part of the reason why I wanted it was because I saw female officials who were good enough but they were not given a chance. Now they have been given a chance and they have earned it.
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  #29 (permalink)  
Old Tue Feb 20, 2018, 05:13pm
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CJP, I completely agree with you
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  #30 (permalink)  
Old Tue Feb 20, 2018, 06:01pm
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Originally Posted by CJP View Post
Why didn't you comment in response to post #2? That is stretching some things. The statement in #2 says more.
Do I have to comment on everything? He's ultimately right. Hiring based on race, gender, etc. is simply wrong in any way, shape or form.
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