Originally Posted by BigCat (Post 997646)

That is the point. A player dribbling in FC is in control. If he bounced ball on division line he's caused it to be in BC. Steps on line.same. It takes 3 to get u to FC but once you there it only takes one to put you in BC. As far as player holding or dribbling ball, the division line is like a boundary.

Originally Posted by Adam (Post 997647)

I think you'd be better using the precedent of a dribbler stepping on the OOB (while not holding the ball) line as support for this. I think you're right, and that's how I would call it, but 3 points verbiage is a thin nail for this hat to hang.

Originally Posted by BigCat (Post 997649)

I am not hanging anything on that. I was guessing that folks thinking once a player was in FC dribbling, if he simply stepped on the line or dribbled ball on the line it wasn't a violation. I was guessing they were saying it took 3 parts to go back to BC.

My point all along is that 3 parts is a rule to put you in FC. Once you're in it, that rule is over. A player dribbling is in control of ball. If he steps on line or dribbles on it he's violated. Caused ball to be in BC etc

Originally Posted by BigCat (Post 997649)

I am not hanging anything on that. I was guessing that folks thinking once a player was in FC dribbling, if he simply stepped on the line or dribbled ball on the line it wasn't a violation. I was guessing they were saying it took 3 parts to go back to BC.

My point all along is that 3 parts is a rule to put you in FC. Once you're in it, that rule is over. A player dribbling is in control of ball. If he steps on line or dribbles on it he's violated. Caused ball to be in BC etc

Originally Posted by Camron Rust (Post 997656)

It is not a violation to cause the ball to be in the backcourt. Only touching first after causing it to go into the backcourt is a violation (after having last touched it before it went to the backcourt).

Also, as I posted above, the ball location rules actually do not say the ball is in the backcourt when the dribbler steps on the line unless the dribbler is touching the ball while doing so. The clause that covers that for OOBs situations is specifically in the OOB section and mentioned boundaries and doesn't mention the division line.


Likewise for a dribble that hits the line...causing it to be in the backcourt isn't the violation, it is the subsequent touch, according to the rules as far as I can tell?

So, while I have always called it this way, what, by rule, makes it a violation for just stepping/dribbling on the division line?

Originally Posted by Adam (Post 997651)

Well hell. I misunderstood you.

Carry on.

Originally Posted by BigCat (Post 997660)

This will be abbreviated response. You are looking at ball location rule. Look at player control rule. A player holding or dribbling the ball has player control. There are two plays/rules. The player dribbling the ball who steps on the line is deemed OB because he has CONTROL. Interrupted dribble play. Player steps on line, no violation cause no control. These are actually in the rules as opposed to case book. Those plays are just as much about control and player location than the are about inbounds/out of bounds.

Now, you know 1. the BC consists of area plus the division line. 2. Our player is dribbling ball in FC. All the way in. 3. That means team control in FC. 4. If he steps on the line while in control of the ball , holding or dribbling, he is now In BC. The two situations are about control and location. 5. He was last to touch inFC and he dribbled into BC or stepped there.

Now if dribble interrupted and ball hits line then he is not in control and while the ball may be in BC he is not in control and is therefore not touching it in BC. As you said, simply causing it to go to BC isn't enough. However, IF HE IS IN CONTROL of ball and touches the line or dribbles ball on other side of line he IS in BC. Violation in all 3

Forget I said abbreviated.��