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-   -   Disagreement with Crew Partner (https://forum.officiating.com/basketball/102074-disagreement-crew-partner.html)

Adam Tue Jan 10, 2017 03:44pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by wheels (Post 996932)
Why isn't it a PC foul? The defender had LGP and the offensive player ran into her. It's not the defenders fault she didn't go down. The defender took the contact. :confused:
A foul isn't just any contact. It requires some displacement or prevention from participating in normal offensive or defensive movements. The defender wasn't at all disadvantaged by this, in fact her presence did the job. It stopped a pg, and likely will make that pg think twice before running into the trees again.

BryanV21 Tue Jan 10, 2017 03:47pm
Off-topic question, although it was brought up here, so...

I don't see the word "displace" (or a variation of it) in the definition of a foul. I was actually going to use it in my previous post, but didn't after not seeing the word.

Did I simply miss it somewhere?

wheels Tue Jan 10, 2017 03:48pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by BadNewsRef (Post 996934)
How was the defender disadvantaged?
The defender was there to take a charge. The offensive was running hard enough to bounce off the defensive player. That has to be a foul. If the defender was not LGP and the offensive player bounces off, I'm sure you would call a blocking foul. Reward the defender for her attaining LGP and taking the contact.

Camron Rust Tue Jan 10, 2017 03:49pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich (Post 996930)
Except that the OP called a travel and THEN the partner ran in to "overrule" him.

That changes things, at least it does for me.

That partner's block doesn't overrule my "she had LGP".
That isn't how I read the OP. I read it to be that the other official came in with a block just after the whistle for the travel. Unfortunately "she had LGP" isn't a call to be overruled.

Rich Tue Jan 10, 2017 03:51pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by wheels (Post 996942)
The defender was there to take a charge. The offensive was running hard enough to bounce off the defensive player. That has to be a foul. If the defender was not LGP and the offensive player bounces off, I'm sure you would call a blocking foul. Reward the defender for her attaining LGP and taking the contact.
The defender was there to play defense.

If I make calls like that in the real world, I'll be working levels where calls like this are routinely made...and they only hire 2 officials.

wheels Tue Jan 10, 2017 03:55pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by JRutledge (Post 996938)
Was the defender displaced? Was the defender put at any disadvantage by the contact? How is the ball handler fouling a defender when the defender is bigger and does not move?

Again, this is why 4-27 is in the rule book.

Peace
read 4-7-2a

rockyroad Tue Jan 10, 2017 03:59pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by VaTerp (Post 996886)
This is a prime example of why I HATE when people pre-game "if there's a body on the floor we MUST have a whistle." No, we don't. Rule 4-27-2 clearly states otherwise.

.
Agreed. Hate that statement...better to say "if there's a body on the floor, we must know how they got there"

wheels Tue Jan 10, 2017 04:01pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich (Post 996944)
The defender was there to play defense.

If I make calls like that in the real world, I'll be working levels where calls like this are routinely made...and they only hire 2 officials.
So you are penalizing her for being a bigger player and not flopping.

JRutledge Tue Jan 10, 2017 04:11pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by wheels (Post 996948)
read 4-7-2a
So what did the ball handler do to impede the progress of the opponent? Nothing, they bounced off of them and fell.

Again, you did not read 4-27.

Peace

BryanV21 Tue Jan 10, 2017 04:14pm
4-7-2a explains a type of foul call, but does not define whether it is indeed a foul or not. I believe you want 4-19-1

BigT Tue Jan 10, 2017 04:17pm
Could we sell that travel call and if our partner runs in with a late foul say you were responsible for the defender and they had LGP and we are moving on?

wheels Tue Jan 10, 2017 04:24pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by JRutledge (Post 996953)
So what did the ball handler do to impede the progress of the opponent? Nothing, they bounced off of them and fell.

Again, you did not read 4-27.

Peace
This play is not incidental contact play. The defender beat her to the spot. so just because the ball handler wasn't strong enough to knock her down, it not a PC? but if she goes does it is?

Raymond Tue Jan 10, 2017 04:35pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by wheels (Post 996963)
This play is not incidental contact play. The defender beat her to the spot. so just because the ball handler wasn't strong enough to knock her down, it not a PC? but if she goes does it is?
Yes

Rich Tue Jan 10, 2017 04:39pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by wheels (Post 996963)
This play is not incidental contact play. The defender beat her to the spot. so just because the ball handler wasn't strong enough to knock her down, it not a PC? but if she goes does it is?
Yes.

JRutledge Tue Jan 10, 2017 04:56pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by wheels (Post 996963)
This play is not incidental contact play. The defender beat her to the spot. so just because the ball handler wasn't strong enough to knock her down, it not a PC? but if she goes does it is?
Yes!!! And displacement would be required. Knocking them down is not the standard.

Peace


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