I was discussing APG's comments on the defender embellishing contact.

The main problem of putting more than one video in a thread. :/

True, but I would rather have one thread with all the plays instead of 3 or 4 different threads with several plays. All he had to do is quote the play, but I can understand why he did not do that in this situation.

Peace

GT - The ball does appear to be on the downward flight. Now from this angle I can't tell if it still has a chance to go in after the initial deflection. Assuming it does that is a good get at that speed and angle.

PC - I think you have to get that one all the time. Regardless of "embellishment" the offense is creating and holding space they are not entitled to with their forearm if defense was doing it we would have a call. If you just no call it the offense is using illegal contact to gain advantage regardless of the sell job.

Travel - Broken play. Fumble happens before a foot is lifted. Depending on which foot official judges as pivot would be the difference here. There is an argument to be made that there is travel before the fall happens (1 foot hop, into 1-2 landing). But I didn't catch it until the slow mo.

Vid Request: Texas vs Oklahoma
 

If I'm going to call that extended forearm against the defense (one of the automatics) then I'm going to call the PC foul when the ball handler does it, too.

100% agree on the extended forearm.

That's why I'm wondering why nobody else has a PC foul on the travel play. A1 bangs into the torso of B1, who had LGP, and was displaced several feet. If B1 had created that kind of contact on A1, I think we all would agree it's a foul.

Agreed, but I've got a travel on 5 after he gets control, before I see a foul.

Judgement. In this case, while there might be some displacement, the contact did not prevent B1 from performing any defensive movements. In fact, it simply knocked A1 to the floor.

Banging into the torso isn't an automatic.

I figure if it's an automatic foul on B, why should A be able to do it?

Again, because that is acceptable contact. The ball handler falls, so not sure what disadvantage he is put at when the guy that comes at him falls.

And I think your "several feet" is an exaggeration. He moves, but not as much as the ball handler.

This is why you see the play start, develop and finish. If you call a play in the start process, you call a foul that obviously did not need to be called. If the ball handler does not drop the ball, we have a travel for sure.

Again, all contact is not a foul. Players are not going to be stationary when contacted. Obviously a guy that did some weights stood his ground and was still in position to keep his position and helped cause the ball handler to fall.

Peace

That's the point I'm making. I'm not saying I would have called it, but I was surprised that nobody was discussing that part of the play.

(Talking about the travel video)

Nothing in that video is an automatic.

And I agree with some others here. One video per thread is what's going to be considered best practices going forward.

Edited to say: This has revealed a schism between the moderators, so we'll be discussing it further. In the meantime, please clearly mention which play you're talking about.

I still say he traveled before he fell by replacing his pivot foot. Pretty clearly to me and also with the benefit of slow mo replay.

The L can't see exactly when he loses control of the ball because he's looking through bodies.

It would have been on the C to get the travel here and Buddy Hield is blocking his view.

No travel on the fall.

If members get a vote, I vote for one video per thread.

What do you do if people ask for several plays in one thread? Part of this is member driven.

Peace