Did the umpires make the correct call?

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

This game was between the Reds and the Phillies earlier this week. Mark, Jr., and I are not sure the umpires made the correct call.

Here is the HuffingtonPost.com article with a link to the video: Reds Strange Double Play: Drew Stubbs, Brandon Phillips Turn Two After Blown Call (VIDEO)

MTD, Sr.

[Altor]

I've watched that video 5 times, including 3 times before you posted it. I still don't know what was actually called on the field. Going by the MLB play-by-play and the announcers saying that U1 called the batter out, they apparently called it a fly out and an appeal at 2nd. If that's true, I would tend to agree with you: Stubbs did not make the catch.

That said, the real lesson from this video is...expanded replay would not be as smooth as some believe. Just imagine if this catch was overturned "after further review."

[dash_riprock]

If it was ruled a no-catch, it would not have been a double play.

[cookie]

Originally Posted by Altor

I've watched that video 5 times, including 3 times before you posted it. I still don't know what was actually called on the field. Going by the MLB play-by-play and the announcers saying that U1 called the batter out, they apparently called it a fly out and an appeal at 2nd. If that's true, I would tend to agree with you: Stubbs did not make the catch.

That said, the real lesson from this video is...expanded replay would not be as smooth as some believe. Just imagine if this catch was overturned "after further review."

I guess 9.02c would get a lot of action in instances like these if video replay became reality. Possible outcome of an umpire conference might be: Because of umpire error (calling a trapped ball a catch with bases loaded and 1 out), R1 is out on the force, place BR on 1st, R2 on 3rd, and score R3. Runners now at 1st and 3rd with 2 outs. Anyway you try to resolve it, it's going to be a sh$tstorm with probable ejections...

Can you imagine the cluster.... if R3 were the tying or winning run (and in a playoff game)!!!

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by cookie

I guess 9.02c would get a lot of action in instances like these if video replay became reality. Possible outcome of an umpire conference might be: Because of umpire error (calling a trapped ball a catch with bases loaded and 1 out), R1 is out on the force, place BR on 1st, R2 on 3rd, and score R3. Runners now at 1st and 3rd with 2 outs. Anyway you try to resolve it, it's going to be a sh$tstorm with probable ejections...

Can you imagine the cluster.... if R3 were the tying or winning run (and in a playoff game)!!!

No, they wouldn't have scored R3 - R3 went back to third (if he hadn't, he likely would have been thrown out too). R2 kind of has to get placed back on 2nd by default.

[Manny A]

Originally Posted by mbcrowder

No, they wouldn't have scored R3 - R3 went back to third (if he hadn't, he likely would have been thrown out too). R2 kind of has to get placed back on 2nd by default.

Agree. It would make no sense to allow R3 to score here since he never made an effort to try. The likely outcome would be just the force out at second base, and the bases remaining loaded with two outs.

What I didn't see from the video replay (I couldn't call up the Huffington Post link, so I checked out the replay on MLB.com) is whether or not the four umpires got together to discuss the catch/no-catch call.

Baseball Video Highlights & Clips | Must C Call: Reds' odd double play ends the fourth - Video | MLB.com: Multimedia

[maven]

Originally Posted by Manny A

What I didn't see from the video replay (I couldn't call up the Huffington Post link, so I checked out the replay on MLB.com) is whether or not the four umpires got together to discuss the catch/no-catch call.

HuffPo simply embedded the MLB video. You saw the same clip.

[cookie]

Originally Posted by mbcrowder

No, they wouldn't have scored R3 - R3 went back to third (if he hadn't, he likely would have been thrown out too). R2 kind of has to get placed back on 2nd by default.

That's one possible outcome of the umpire conference. However, I think R3 held up because he saw the umpire signal catch. Had the umpire signaled "no catch," he would have easily scored. The umpire error caused him to remain at 3rd...

[Manny A]

Originally Posted by cookie

I think R3 held up because he saw the umpire signal catch. Had the umpire signaled "no catch," he would have easily scored. The umpire error caused him to remain at 3rd...

Perhaps. Or perhaps R3 stayed at third to tag up, just in case. And given that R3 was Ryan Howard, I seriously doubt he would have "easily scored" as quickly as the ball was thrown in. It ain't like Ryan is the textbook definition of "blazing speed".

Regardless, this would clearly be a situation where the umpires would have to "play God" to decide what to do, which is the main reason why catch/no-catch is not currently subject to replay.

[johnnyg08]

Right now, full replay at the MLB level would not be better for the game