when is inside pick to 2nd a balk?

[Bfair]

Tee is totally incorrect in saying or implying the pitcher need not step if throwing or feinting to 2B from the pitching rubber. There must be a step with the nonpivot foot if the move is from the rubber. If he steps to 1B or 3B from the rubber yet throws or feints to 2B, it is a balk.

Evans in JEA 8.05(c) states:

Customs and Usage: For practical enforcement purposes, stepping directly means stepping within 45 degrees of a direct, straight line to the base. In other words, the pitcher is NOT stepping MORE toward a different base than the one to which he is throwing.

Please note, Tee, it doesn't limit the bases to 1B and home or 3B and home. If stepping more toward another base than to the one which he is throwing or feinting, a balk is committed---and that includes 2B.

It's a judgment call as to where he is stepping.
And while it's more difficult to balk to 2B due to the allowances provided by umpire judgment, it's still definitely possible.


Freix


BTW, Tee, I'll not add the IIITBTSB to the list of "misses" until credit is claimed---but it wouldn't surprise me.....

[Tim C]

When did this turn personal. I am neither crazy nor have I been on a binge.

I have worked pretty high levels of baseball and have never had any difficulties with those games.

No matter how Steve works around it the plays that I described in my last example are correct.

Because F1 is NEVER required to throw the ball in a pickoff at second base he is NOT limited to the directional dictates of the rule.

That is my position and it will not change.

Steve, a miss is a good as a smile, at times.

Tee

[wpiced]

Tee, please don't take my post personally. None of your posts were responsive to mine, and I suppose I am used to direct replies rather that meandering. Your scenarios are pointless within the context of my question to you. Remeber the very first post about when is the motion to second base (by an 11 year old?) a balk? You were nonreponsive then as you were in defining OBR 8.01(c).

Words have meaning and conveyance, and since this is a public forum, others may become confused by your comments, but certainly I do not want them confused by mine. Soooo, the beat goes on. You prefer to stick to your guns (that's ok), and I will allow my posts to speak soley for me.

[wpiced]

Coach Dave,

I hope all this silly banter hasn't turned you off nor made you sorry that you ever asked the question.

It's been fun and has hopefully made every reader stop and think.

[Tim C]

I am going to make one more legitimate attempt to bring you to the dark side, OK!

F1 (Righthander) is in the set position with R2 (only - for this example).

F6 and F4 are darting "in and out" trying to hold R2 close to the base.

His lead grows.

F1 turns to throw to second and finds the base uncovered so he does not throw at all (on this example I don't care where he steps). No balk, correct?

Same situation:

F1 turns to throw to second to second. Finds "no one home" so he throws to F6 who is in his "normal" position not near the base. The step is directly towards F6 and NOT the base. No balk, correct -- he didn't even have to throw the ball so why would it be a balk.

Slightly different situation:

R2 and R3. Infield in -- in fact F6 is standing next to R2 on the third base side of R2. He is even with him.

F1 steps 1/2 way betwix F6 and the base at third and fires to F6 who applies a tag to "napping" R2. No balk, correct? I mean there is a play (that is important).

So Marty, crazy as you may consider me . . . or getting over a bout of binge drinking that is the logic taken by the people on "my side" of this issue.

Now unlike you, I will allow you the respect of what you call and only laugh at the ISSUE in my mind when it occurs.

Last, if my profile is actual of interest to you or anyone I certainly will update it if necessary.

Tee

[Bfair]

Originally posted by Tim C
They don't "need" to step towards second base.

Not in the rules.

Tee

Tee, this statement is absolutely wrong if a move is made to 2B from the rubber.
While you can masquerade whatever you want to judge as being a legal step to 2B vs. elsewhere, the "need" to step is a requirement when the move is made from the rubber---reference rule 8.05(c).

Before long you'll be telling me that in NCAA that it's legal to make a feint from the rubber to any base without first stepping there.........Lah, me.


Freix

[Tim C]

"Before long you'll be telling me that in NCAA that it's legal to make a feint from the rubber to any base without first stepping there.........Lah, me."

Why would I say that?

Strange example.

Tee

[wpiced]

Freix, Tee

I am compelled to say that I love you both. I agree with one of you and disagree with the other, BUT in any event, I had to put on my thinking cap -- and that is why I have joined this discussion board.

I hope others have enjoyed it too, and have also had to think a little.

Thank you gentlemen.

[GarthB]

I agree with one of you and disagree with the other,

Of course. That's the easy part. Now, tell us which is which.