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-   -   balk on the 45 degree lhp (https://forum.officiating.com/baseball/53541-balk-45-degree-lhp.html)

bossman72 Mon Jun 08, 2009 01:27pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by bob jenkins (Post 607322)
Huh? It's PRIMARILY the plate umpire's call. It would be much more understandable if he had it and you didn't.
Right. CCA manual recommends PU calling the "step balks"

jwwashburn Mon Jun 08, 2009 01:33pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by bossman72 (Post 607376)
Right. CCA manual recommends PU calling the "step balks"
Boss, I thought that was the case. If the BU can see this, it must have been very bad. The PU has the best angle on it.

MrUmpire Mon Jun 08, 2009 03:01pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by jwwashburn (Post 607388)
Boss, I thought that was the case. If the BU can see this, it must have been very bad. The PU has the best angle on it.
In threeman, as in the OP, U1 has an excellent view of this balk, in my opinion, better than PU.

jwwashburn Mon Jun 08, 2009 03:29pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrUmpire (Post 607422)
In threeman, as in the OP, U1 has an excellent view of this balk, in my opinion, better than PU.
The BU would have an ok view. The PU is looking at it straight on and, therefore, has the best view...that is why the CCA manual has the PU calling step balks.

Kevin Finnerty Mon Jun 08, 2009 03:38pm
PU has the best view of progress toward first, and BU has the best view of this call, which involves progress toward the plate.

MrUmpire Mon Jun 08, 2009 05:23pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by jwwashburn (Post 607435)
The BU would have an ok view. The PU is looking at it straight on and, therefore, has the best view...that is why the CCA manual has the PU calling step balks.
Nonsense. that's like saying the first base coach has the best view of the outside corner...same angle.

U1 is looking straight at the front of the leg and can see better than anyone other than BU coach at third whether or not a LHP is stepping more to one side or the other. Simple geometry.

The folks at CCA, God bless them, are not perfect.

socalblue1 Mon Jun 08, 2009 05:30pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrUmpire (Post 607475)
Nonsense. U1 is looking straight at the leg and can see better than anyone other than BU coach at third whether or not a LHP is stepping more to one side or the other. Simple geometry.

The folks at CCA, God bless them, are not perfect.
I agree. Either can call both though PU has the best angle for distance, BU for direction.

JJ Mon Jun 08, 2009 11:12pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by justanotherblue (Post 607332)
Dash has it. The calling umpire should approach the coach as he is patting his chest saying, I got it coach, that's a balk, he did.....
OK, but then I look like an idiot. Sorry, I already do that enough on my own. "Yes, coach, I called a balk, but I don't know why. Let's ask my partner!"
I MIGHT echo the "Time" call, but never the "Balk" call unless I see the balk, too.

JJ

Steven Tyler Tue Jun 09, 2009 12:05am
Quote:
Originally Posted by SanDiegoSteve (Post 607271)
Absolutely. All umpires should at least echo the call. This could save a big argument when the coach hears it coming from every direction. Isn't that why we have partners in the first place? I've never been too shy to call a balk, or echo my partner's balk call, whether I saw the balk or not. If my partner says it's a balk, it's a balk.
Can't call something if you didn't see it....:(

MrUmpire Tue Jun 09, 2009 12:36am
Quote:
Originally Posted by SanDiegoSteve (Post 607271)
Absolutely. All umpires should at least echo the call. This could save a big argument when the coach hears it coming from every direction. Isn't that why we have partners in the first place? I've never been too shy to call a balk, or echo my partner's balk call, whether I saw the balk or not. If my partner says it's a balk, it's a balk.
We echo the "time" call, but not the balk, unless we saw it. We don't make calls that we don't see.

JR12 Tue Jun 09, 2009 01:07am
Also the coach CAN"T come out on a step balk. He is risking ejection. MLBUM.

mbyron Tue Jun 09, 2009 06:09am
Quote:
Originally Posted by JR12 (Post 607577)
Also the coach CAN"T come out on a step balk. He is risking ejection. MLBUM.
The MLBUM governs MLB, and I would never eject a coach merely for asking why I called a balk.

Of course, when I call a balk he already knows the problem:

"Balk! Time! That's a balk, no step!"

"Balk! Time! That's a balk, no stop!"

"Balk! Time! That's a balk, started and stopped!"

etc.

SethPDX Tue Jun 09, 2009 03:08pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by mbyron (Post 607586)
The MLBUM governs MLB, and I would never eject a coach merely for asking why I called a balk.
Which is why I don't feel like the MLB manual is something I absolutely must get my hands on.

Can a coach ask for an explanantion? Sure. If he stays out there and keeps arguing, well...

bob jenkins Wed Jun 10, 2009 08:02am
Quote:
Originally Posted by SethPDX (Post 607786)
Which is why I don't feel like the MLB manual is something I absolutely must get my hands on.

Can a coach ask for an explanantion? Sure. If he stays out there and keeps arguing, well...
According to the MLBUM (and maybe PBUC, I forget), the calling umpire is to indicate (I think by slapping his leg) that it was a "no step" balk.

So, the coach already has his explanation. There's no need to come out.

JR12 Wed Jun 10, 2009 06:55pm
Yes, thats the mechanic.


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