Pickoff from the stretch position

[Rufus]

I did a search on this one and couldn't find anything specific so please forgive the question if it's been covered and I couldn't find it.

As an assistant coach of a 12U all-star team I had a parent ask me this question last night and did not know the answer (we play under USSSA).

Can a pitcher make a pick-off attempt from the stretch position? I would think the same restrictions as from the set position (e.g., must step to the bag, can't fake to 1st, etc.) would apply but I couldn't find anything allowing/disallowing it in a review of the USSSA rules regarding balks.

Any assistance in clarifying would be appreciated.

[Welpe]

Did you check rule 8.05 in OBR? That is where you will find your answer if USSSA has no specific provisions.

The rules are the same. He must gain distance and direction while throwing to a base, cannot feint to first, etc.

[Forest Ump]

Originally Posted by Rufus

Can a pitcher make a pick-off attempt from the stretch position? I would think the same restrictions as from the set position (e.g., must step to the bag, can't fake to 1st, etc.) would apply but I couldn't find anything allowing/disallowing it in a review of the USSSA rules regarding balks.

Any assistance in clarifying would be appreciated.

The stretch is a preliminary movement before the set. It's an option that still ends in a set. From the set position, the pitcher can step off, step and throw (feint to 2nd or 3rd), or pitch.

8.01 (c) At any time during the pitcher’s preliminary movements and until his natural pitching motion commits him to the pitch, he may throw to any base provided he steps directly toward such base before making the throw.

[Tim C]

"The stretch is a preliminary movement before the set. It's an option that still ends in a set. From the set position, the pitcher can step off, step and throw (feint to 2nd or 3rd), or pitch. 8.01C"

Actually I don't understand your statement.

There is a wind-up position and a set position.

A pitcher can step off, step and throw or feint (except to 1st in in contact with the pitcher's plate) ANYTIME during the activity associated with the set position. He does not have to attain any actual "set position" to do any of these things.

[Rufus]

Originally Posted by Tim C

Actually I don't understand your statement.

There is a wind-up position and a set position.

A pitcher can step off, step and throw or feint (except to 1st in in contact with the pitcher's plate) ANYTIME during the activity associated with the set position. He does not have to attain any actual "set position" to do any of these things.

Tim
I was confused a bit after first reading that too, but I think it means that the stretch position is the beginning of (i.e., part of) the set position. As such it has the same limitations/allowances as the set position.

Forest - If I've misinterpreted your statement please let me know.

Welpe - I did just now check 8.05 and that seems consistent with USSSA. 8.01 quoted by Forest seems to address it specifically.

[Forest Ump]

Tim...After reading that, I agree it was not very clear. I think the OP was asking if the pitcher could attempt a pick off during the stretch motion.

I was pointing out that the stretch is a preliminary movement associated with the set position. The pitcher does not have to use the stretch. It's an option. He can just join his hands, come set, and pitch or he can use the motion known as the stretch. He still must come set either way. He can pitch, step and throw or feint, or step off while making the preliminary motion to come set.

Rufus and I are both from Georgia. He knew what I meant.

[JPaco54]

I thought the pitcher had to have his foot on the rubber to take signals before he becomes set. Not sure I understand "set". So, Pitcher places foot on rubber, brings hands together and pauses, then he can do pitch, step-off, throw to a base or feint.

[Ump153]

Originally Posted by JPaco54

I thought the pitcher had to have his foot on the rubber to take signals before he becomes set. Not sure I understand "set". So, Pitcher places foot on rubber, brings hands together and pauses, then he can do pitch, step-off, throw to a base or feint.

Really?

[mbyron]

Originally Posted by Ump153

Really?

Really.

Feint: deceive by a mock action; "The midfielder feinted to shoot"

F1 may do this to 2B or 3B.

[Ump153]

Originally Posted by mbyron

Really.

Feint: deceive by a mock action; "The midfielder feinted to shoot"

F1 may do this to 2B or 3B.

Yes, but he cannot do this to first and the statement was worded universally. So, again: Really?

There are THREE things any pitcher can do after coming set. Pitch, disengage, step and throw to a base. (OBR 8.0)

[MrUmpire]

Originally Posted by mbyron

Really.

Feint: deceive by a mock action; "The midfielder feinted to shoot"

F1 may do this to 2B or 3B.

You must write the FED tests.

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally Posted by mbyron

Really.

Feint: deceive by a mock action; "The midfielder feinted to shoot"

F1 may do this to 2B or 3B.

Hmmm...I think I'm starting to feel faint.

[Nigel Tufnel]

Originally Posted by Ump153

Yes, but he cannot do this to first and the statement was worded universally. So, again: Really?

There are THREE things any pitcher can do after coming set. Pitch, disengage, step and throw to a base. (OBR 8.0)

Hmm...so he can't balk??? or call time???

Don't you hate it when people just pick apart a logical response...me too..

[mbyron]

Originally Posted by Ump153

Yes, but he cannot do this to first and the statement was worded universally. So, again: Really?

There are THREE things any pitcher can do after coming set. Pitch, disengage, step and throw to a base. (OBR 8.0)

Again, yes, really. Although the statement was worded universally, it was also worded disjunctively. So one of the things F1 may always do after coming set is to step and (throw OR feint) to a base.

Your way of stating the permissible actions is also misleading, since (by your reasoning) F1 may never feint to any base.

[Ump153]

Originally Posted by mbyron

Again, yes, really. Although the statement was worded universally, it was also worded disjunctively. So one of the things F1 may always do after coming set is to step and (throw OR feint) to a base.

Your way of stating the permissible actions is also misleading, since (by your reasoning) F1 may never feint to any base.

Now you're just being stubborn.

The obvious difference is that my list is what a pitcher ALWAYS can do to any base and is the wording found in 8.01 (b)

Next time you attend an Evans clinic and when he recites the three actions I listed, be sure to stand up right away and say "You forgot feint!"