This shows the level of your integrity--making things up that I have never said.

Tell me where I defended the behavior. I gave an explanation as to why they acted this way, but never defended it.

Respect does not have to be earned. It is a right as a human being, until one loses that right through action, or gains more by virtue of action or position.

You are applying adult standards and manly respectability to children who haven't earned a shred of it.

Joe's instinct was to make these two smart-a$$es aware of some of what they need to learn to merely function in the role that they are already pretending to fill and maybe help them stop cheating little kids with their shoddy, uninformed work. Any experienced umpire who offers any beginner some umpiring tips should be received respectfully and without hesitation.

An experienced adult umpire being approached at the car by a coach is an entirely different situation. For that, there is an established standard that is not in place for children posing as umpires.

Okay. Open question to all of you in the "these kids today, with their hair and their clothes, why you little ... mumble mumble five cents for a movie mumble mumble FDR mumble" group:

Is the pitchfork-and-torch reaction based on the response, or the age, of the umpires in question?

In other words: make these umpires my age (nearly 44), and try to replay the scenario in your head cleanly. Would you still harrumph as much, or would your responses to the OP been more of a "don't f--- with the umpires post-game about calls"? I believe it would be the latter.

Look, on this board on numerous occasions, as I said before, there are stories of Dad/Junior/Junior's Coach approaching an umpire at his car, or on his way to the lot, after a game. And we on the board have had the consensus of that being A Bad Thing.

If you hate the upcoming generations, fine - but just be honest and admit it influences your response here. (Like I said earlier, I have 2 teens of my own, and witnessing what's coming through the pipeline, with the MyFaceSpaceBook, and seemingly every kid acting like a wannabe gangsta, etc, etc, makes me worry about when that generation is in charge of my breathing tube one day. But I try not to knee-jerk about every last d@mn one of them.)

....and I'm not condoning whichever umpire yelled at jwwashburn as he walked away. I do think the "stop sign" and the "that's enough", while not the optimal response, probably, was still a response to the essential statement of "I know the rule, and maybe you should try learning the rules sometime" from a 'rat coach.' We all know that's what WE'D think if we'd been the umpires at the car.

Oh.

It read as a defense. And I didn't quote you, but voiced my interpretation of your curious defense of these two.

I didn't question your integrity, so please don't misread something and then insult mine.

I'm astonished that you would infer all of this based on our opinion on the specific case of two smart-a$$ed kids in a youth baseball setting.

Wow. Seriously, you have some hostility issues with America's youth, mate.

One, I don't think Joe felt they were smart-asses, and they were "pretenders" and they were "cheating little kids" BEFORE he approached them - that sounds more like your emotions painting the post.

Two, no where in Joe's OP says that he approached them as an "experienced umpire" offering "umpiring tips." IIRC, he asked if could ask a question, but did not ID himself. So again, you're looking to just hammer these kids because they're, well, kids.

KF, if a coach - again, Joe was a COACH and not ID'd otherwise - had come to you and, in the course of the discussion, said "you should learn the rules" in so many words, would you have liked it, and said "why, I'll take that on board!"? Really?

Yeah, and it's called when-the-coach-comes-to-your-car-after-the-game-to-b!tch-you-tell-him-to-eff-off.

If this was truly meant to be a learning experience, go to the assignor or the UIC of the league, and voice concerns.

You're acting as though only those under 21 f--- up OBS calls. And you're acting like that scary guy at the end of the block who has a 40-year collection of balls, bikes, kites, etc. from the neighborhood children.

Your interpretation was that Matt thinks these young men responded appropriately? You either didn't read what he said closely enough or you're just being disingenuous and disrespectful, which I find a bit ironic.

Well, without digging that hard, I can look at your posts 3, 11, 23, 28 and 33, at least to get a sense of that. Toss in some of SDS's posts, and I don't think my inference is that far off.

(And "two smart-a$$ed kids" sort of gives your stance away, don't you think? :) )

Hey, dont bring me into this fight.:mad:

I see 2 mistakes in the OP. The 1st is the coach approaching the umpires post game. The 2nd is the reaction from those umpires. Mistakes on both sides.

Joe posted only 2 complaints about the umpires, so "cheating little kids with their shoddy, uninformed work" is not a valid statement and over the top. I'm sure I've kicked a couple in a game once but wouldnt describe my actions like you did.

And we all have heard a coach claim "but I'm an umpire, so.." and realize that its (true or not, mostly not) just a ploy to get his way. Good umpires that coach should know to leave their officials hat at home, and not try to use that to get their way. So in this sich, Joe wasnt an experienced umpire offering tips to beginners, he was a coach, plain and simple....

A more proper way to state your interpretation would have been, "It appears that you feel that the behavior exhibited by these two was appropriate," or something to that effect, maybe even "So you think these two jackasses were right?"

I didn't misread anything. This sentence is attributing a sentiment to me that is not mine (putting words in my mouth, if you will.)

Sorry. Sometimes, collateral damage may occur. ;)

I have had coaches respectfully approach me after a game about rules. I refer him to the UIC because the UIC has asked us to do so.

If it is a simple question and I know the coach (and I know the coach to be levelheaded, I sometimes will answer it if we are out of the earshot of other people.

I am 41 years old and I would have had no problem with a coach approaching me in the way that I approached these two guys. If I had kicked a rules interp. I certainly would have a lot more patience.

Joe

I got photos of the two guys:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...visprofile.jpg http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_6KoPNrNgNV...0/butthead.jpg