New Umpire School...O.U.T.S.

[Thatballzlow]

Hey, want some input about a new umpire school I just found on the internet...it's called O.U.T.S....Oceanside Umpire Training School...it's located in Cocoa, Florida...at the Cocoa Expo...nice facility...worked there a few times...anyhow...give you a quick synopsis...seems to have some unique ideas:

Two-week and one-week courses...room and board provided
Appears to be set up for guys looking to move up in high school and college baseball...it's not a school to go for a job in MiLB...
Instructors are half former pro umps and half college umps...
Owner is a ten-year veteran of MiLB...Bob Bainter...I saw him work once in the IL...pretty good umpire...never got the call, but we've all seen good guys not make it...but had a great reputation...
My favorite part is that students are going to umpire full games while being instructed/evaluated...you don't get that at a pro school...cool idea...

The website is www.outschool.biz...what do you guys think...? I'm thinking about attending...

call strikes...please, lord...call strikes

[MrUmpire]

Sounds like Cocoa Expo has found a way to get free umpires.

In the past, new PBUC grads hung out and worked their games to pick up some bucks prior to rookie league start up.

Working "real games" at a camp is not all it's cracked up to be. Some games are really boring and you will get little chance to work on many skills.

The "camp games" used at pro schools allow students to experience many, many more situations and work on a more complete set of skills.

[Thatballzlow]

I've worked at Cocoa in the past...met a bunch of the PBUC guys...I know that PBUC has a deal with the Coastal Plain(s)? League this year to provide umpires...so probably won't be as many guys this year after their camp...

I attended umpire school and I liked the camp games...you can control the situation for the umpires...I agree, sometimes the games at Cocoa weren't the greatest...LOL...but actual, unscripted games would be a different idea...I'll give the school a ring tonight...let you know what I find out.

Call 'em strikes!

[Bob Bainter]

Hey, thatballzlow! Thanks for the question on this forum. I didn't even know this existed. Interesting website. Someone e-mailed me and told me that our school was on this site, so I thought I'd sign up and respond!

Mr. Umpire, I am with you on the camp games idea. I remember when I went to Harry's school we had all those set up plays where they'd whisper in your ear "Hey, balk during this at-bat"...Trust me, that was the only time I've ever pitched. I didn't hit any of my fellow students, so I guess we all made it through ok. The idea of umpiring the actual games was just to give this a little bit of a twist. You can read all the manuals you want and hear all the "war" stories but it can never substitute for the real thing. And, believe me, I know some of the games aren't exactly going to be Florida State/Miami, but it's still a great chance to give some real feedback to umpires who want a chance to learn.

As for Cocoa getting free umpiring, I figured somebody would make a crack about that eventually. Jeff Biddle and the people at the Expo have been very good to me over the past 15 years, and when we came up with this idea, they were the first (and only) place I considered. If there is no real incentive for them to do this, than what would the point of having it there be, looking at it from their standpoint. That's why I'm putting my name on this post, because I won't hide behind any fake screennames. I stand by my staff and my ideas, and there will be always be doubters.

I know there has been a lot of animosity between former professional umpires and college umpires. Some ex-pros, even guys I know personally, think they're better than college umpires because they worked "in the game"...and I can't blame the college umpires who have run across these people over the years. Mr. Umpire, I can promise you this, no matter what people may think of me personally, I admire any umpire, from T-Ball to MLB, because anyone who has the guts to put the mask on is a friend of mine.

I appreciate the chance to post, and if you want to join, feel free, if you don't, feel just as free. We will succeed and hopefully bridge the gap in attitude that has happened in the past few years.

Thanks for reading,

Bob Bainter
Oceanside Umpire Training School
Oceanside Umpire Training School - Home

[Thatballzlow]

Hey, I appreciate the info and the honesty. I just might sign up!

Ballzlow

[Umpmazza]

Sounds like a good camp..but what about for guys that live way far from FL?

[Bob Bainter]

Originally Posted by Umpmazza

Sounds like a good camp..but what about for guys that live way far from FL?

I know the economy is bad, and trying to get across country on top of tuition might be difficult, but if someone wants to come, I would definitely check out Orlando Intl on AirTran Airways. They are offering up until the 15th flights around $89 bucks one-way, and for anyone flying in, of course, we will come get them at the airport, it's less than an hour away. I have some guys driving down from the NY area, and I know that when I went to Wendlestedt's, some guys carpooled, to save money...If you want anymore info, just give me a ring or drop me an e-mail, I'm sure I can figure out something.

And another thing, with the economy as bad as it is, I'm not opposed to a discount

[realistic]

Originally Posted by MrUmpire

Sounds like Cocoa Expo has found a way to get free umpires.

In the past, new PBUC grads hung out and worked their games to pick up some bucks prior to rookie league start up.

Working "real games" at a camp is not all it's cracked up to be. Some games are really boring and you will get little chance to work on many skills.

The "camp games" used at pro schools allow students to experience many, many more situations and work on a more complete set of skills.

You are probably about 50% true. The benefit of working these games as a newbie umpire, you get to work out alot of kinks in your mechanics and will have a start at developing a style. The camp games are terrible imho because while different things are being thrown at you, an umpire has the tendency to overlook(miss) the basics. It's like trying to do open heart surgery when you are only qualified to do stitches.

I remember when I was at umpire school in the 80's, I was so worried about hustling and getting to the right spot that I missed a catcher's interference on the batter. Working a real game allows instructor's to see who has talent and who doesn't. An instructor won't put their stamp on an ump if they feel that they are ready to work Z ball.

[MrUmpire]

Originally Posted by realistic

You are probably about 50% true. The benefit of working these games as a newbie umpire, you get to work out alot of kinks in your mechanics and will have a start at developing a style. The camp games are terrible imho because while different things are being thrown at you, an umpire has the tendency to overlook(miss) the basics. It's like trying to do open heart surgery when you are only qualified to do stitches.

I remember when I was at umpire school in the 80's, I was so worried about hustling and getting to the right spot that I missed a catcher's interference on the batter. Working a real game allows instructor's to see who has talent and who doesn't. An instructor won't put their stamp on an ump if they feel that they are ready to work Z ball.

Your are probably 25% accurate.

Over the course of a season, actual games are much better. However, over the course of a 13 day camp, one could work daily and never get to work on double play foot work, or calling an infield fly, or seeing type A obstruction, or many other situations.

Pro-schools have progressed since the 80's. Umpiring is not a static activity.

[Bob Bainter]

Originally Posted by MrUmpire

Your are probably 25% accurate.

Over the course of a season, actual games are much better. However, over the course of a 13 day camp, one could work daily and never get to work on double play foot work, or calling an infield fly, or seeing type A obstruction, or many other situations.

Pro-schools have progressed since the 80's. Umpiring is not a static activity.

Yes, pro-schools have progressed a lot since the 80's. Camp games, have not. They're still a bunch of people playing baseball, who wouldn't be umpiring if they could actually PLAY baseball, trying to execute commands from their instructors on how to screw up their fellow students while the guys actually umpiring these camp games are wondering "when is the other shoe going to drop?"

If you really think that in the course of 13 days, working daily, an umpire will not get to work on double play footwork, then I want to come work with you, because I'd love to have 51-54 outs of boring baseball with all strikeouts and ground balls to first. Infield flies??? Do those not happen as much as I remember? Type A obstruction? You're right about that one, as any other screwed up plays...

...Great umpiring is all about handling situations...but what about all those games you work in a year that have none? When you don't know something is about to happen, that's when you see who has what it takes and who doesn't.

Not arguing, just debating my point of view

[MrUmpire]

Originally Posted by Bob Bainter

Wow...that's not very nice.

Really? I expressed an opinion with which you apparently disagree, but what did I say that was not very nice? I was respectful and polite. Was it not nice to disagree with you?

Not arguing, just debating my point of view

I have no problem with that and I don't consider it as not being "nice."

Perhaps MiLB umpires get all of the possible variations of double plays frequently. I can tell you that I have gone a week or longer of seeing the same double play combination over and over in "real games."

Camp games better expose the potential PBUC candidates to the full spectrum of possibilities. The challenges of real games are what the Rookie Leagues are for.

Not arguing, just presenting my point of view, nicely.

[w_sohl]

I know this is the first year for your camp,but have you thought about setting something like a scholarship up so that some associations can send an official or two for free or a reduced cost to the camp?

I'm stuck here in CA so unfortunately I can't attend, would love to however vacation and travel don't permit.

[Bob Bainter]

Originally Posted by w_sohl

I know this is the first year for your camp,but have you thought about setting something like a scholarship up so that some associations can send an official or two for free or a reduced cost to the camp?

I'm stuck here in CA so unfortunately I can't attend, would love to however vacation and travel don't permit.

I have seriously considered setting up scholarships...if associations have a few members who would like to come together then I would definitely do a package program with them. I can be totally honest with you, my largest expense is housing, food, and insurance, but I can work something out with anyone. All someone has to do is drop me a line or give me a ring.

Bob Bainter
Oceanside Umpire Training School - Home
309-363-9995

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

I have umpired at Cocoa Expo before. It is a nice facility considering it was built by the Houston Colt 45's now the Houston Expos as its spring training facility when they became an expansion team in the National League.

I have a friend who is Mr. Baseball Umpire in Brevard County. If anybody knows anything about this school he will know. I will get back to this thread when I get more information.

MTD, Sr.

[Bob Bainter]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

I have umpired at Cocoa Expo before. It is a nice facility considering it was built by the Houston Colt 45's now the Houston Expos as its spring training facility when they became an expansion team in the National League.

I have a friend who is Mr. Baseball Umpire in Brevard County. If anybody knows anything about this school he will know. I will get back to this thread when I get more information.

MTD, Sr.

Hey, Mark! I have sent some letters to some associations in Florida, and would love to know who Mr. Baseball Umpire is, and that way I can get him as much information as he needs. Otherwise, this idea is so relatively new that about the only people who would have known about it are myself, my staff, and the Expo and the students that have already signed up. I would love to give anyone any information they require. If you have any questions, let me know, I'm available any time.

Bob Bainter
Oceanside Umpire Training School