Signals from the coach to the pitcher

[Rufus]

Originally Posted by RPatrino

Couple of things, 1) how complicated are your signals that you can't trust the catcher to accurately relay them to the pitcher. Solve this problem, make your signs simple, flash them to the catcher and have him relay them to the pitcher. You can also have your pitcher "peek" at you while you are giving the signs yet still have him get them 'officially' from the catcher.

Trust me, not that complicated (I'm not smart enough to come up with something too complex!). The thing I've found with 11U is that they are good at taking small amounts of information in and processing it. Only as we get to the end of the season are they able to start stringing things together ("Oh, the warm up we do with three shuffles then a run is related to how we lead off and steal? Who knew?")

My primary catcher is unreliable with the basics of catching so I don't trust him to accurately relay what I'm calling either. I could work on it but, like I said, I didn't know it was a problem until yesterday. The season is almost over and my desire to add something new to the mix is limited.

[RPatrino]

Here's an other thought, why not have the catcher/pitcher call their own game? I've always wondered why coaches have to call every pitch. If he only throws a fastball and change-up, teach him when and how to use those pitches and let him learn the strategies of the pitch placement and speed changes. Just my 2cents. I coached for 15 years and almost never called a pitch. This is a learning environment, after all.

[Rufus]

Originally Posted by RPatrino

Here's an other thought, why not have the catcher/pitcher call their own game? I've always wondered why coaches have to call every pitch. If he only throws a fastball and change-up, teach him when and how to use those pitches and let him learn the strategies of the pitch placement and speed changes. Just my 2cents. I coached for 15 years and almost never called a pitch. This is a learning environment, after all.

I go back and forth over this, to be honest. Sometimes I think they are capable of it (I know my son and I talk contantly about pitch selection and why you throw certain pitches at certain times) but then there are other times when I think they are having trouble just hitting the glove so why not take something off their plate in terms of mental energy.

The other thing is while my son and I get to spend a bunch of time talking about pitch selection, I don't get to spend that same time with the other pitchers due to practice restrictions. I will admit, however, that when things start going south I will go out to them and say "No more signs, just 4-seam fastballs to the mitt."

[RPatrino]

Rufus, you hit the nail on the head, particularly with very young pitchers. Coaches tend to 'over complicate' things at this level ( sometimes I think HS Varsity coaches do too).

Keep things super simple. Limit the number of different pitches you throw, learn to throw your fastball for consistant strikes in different places (low, high, outside, inside). Use a 2 seamer and a 4 seamer. Learn to throw a change-up before you try a curve. Try to learn a cut fastball or slider. Don't walk anyone, ever.

[mbyron]

Originally Posted by RPatrino

Don't walk anyone, ever.

This follows from the old adage (variously credited to George Bamberger and Ray Miller):
Work fast, change speeds, throw strikes.

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

There is nothing in any baseball rules code that prohibits a pitcher taking a signal from a coach or catcher while not in contact with the rubber, what is important is that the pitcher at least simulates taking a signal from the catcher while in contact with the rubber. As long as the pitcher is at least simulating taking a signal from the catcher then he has complied with the rules.

MTD, Sr.

[TussAgee11]

Rufus -

Your coaching style seems to be refreshing and a nice break from what typically happens in youth sports.

You know your players better than I do, but I have some coaching experience as well as catching experience, and now 4 seasons as an umpire ranging from 10 year olds to adult leagues.

Just remember, and I think you have a good grasp of this, that every moment can be a teaching tool. At some point F2 is going to have to learn to give signs, and it is going to get harder and harder to catch effectively if he doesn't know what pitch is coming. Then me, as the umpire, gets hit more, and then I get cranky

I would suggest involving your catcher in this someway. Also, effective pitching is repetition of everything, similar to a free throw. It might not be a bad habit to have your pitcher take a sign every time, even if it is going to be just fastballs that inning. This will help with repetition, and may avoid balks in the future when he gets older. Certainly will make him not have to think about one more thing, as it will become a habit.

These are my takes as somebody involved in youth baseball, not as an umpire or from a rules standpoint. But umpiring alot has allowed me to see lots of stuff, so I hope you find my advice somewhat worthwhile.

Like I said Coach, you know the situation better than any of us, so I'll let you be the final judge. Just remember, every moment something can be learned at the 11U level

Good luck!

(p.s. See, I can be nice to coaches )

[SAump]

It is also a balk if a runner or runners are on base and the pitcher, while he is not touching the pitcher's plate, makes any movement naturally associated with his pitch, or places his feet on or astride the pitcher's plate, or ...

I agree with those who state that it is not allowed and clearly defined to be a balk by rule. I can't figure out why "or places his feet on" or astride "the pitcher's plate" would be prohibited by rule. The rule is poorly written, however, "it is also a balk rule." Not only for a dangerous quick pitch to an unprepared hitter, but for an unfair advantage gained against a baserunner waiting to take his "fair" lead or trying to steal a base on the next pitch. Sorry coach, the pitcher can't straddle the pitcher's plate to delay the runner's early attempt to establish his position on the basepath.

I did not post anything about a pitcher taking signs. I simply posted that a pitcher may not straddle the rubber. If a pitcher is taking his signs while straddling the rubber; that's a balk. Step on or step off, but do not straddle. I haven't figured out how to step off legally without straddling the rubber first, so there must be some kind of timing involved. It also makes it uncomfortable for those who prefer to straddle the rubber just before stepping on, again a long delay must be an issue.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by RPatrino

Rufus, you hit the nail on the head, particularly with very young pitchers. Coaches tend to 'over complicate' things at this level ( sometimes I think HS Varsity coaches do too).

Keep things super simple. Limit the number of different pitches you throw, learn to throw your fastball for consistant strikes in different places (low, high, outside, inside). Use a 2 seamer and a 4 seamer. Learn to throw a change-up before you try a curve. Try to learn a cut fastball or slider. Don't walk anyone, ever.

I was working a game earlier this week where the home team was severely overmatched by the visiting F1. They couldn't touch his fastball. So what did F1 do when he got ahead in the count? Throw a curveball, which the home team jumped all over.

I wanted to go over to the coach and tell him he was an idiot, but I didn't. Why would you ever stick down anything but number 1 if the other team proved they couldn't touch it no matter how many times the pitcher threw it?