Hit by Pitch

[noleump]

This is my first post,please go easy.I am very new as an umpire 2 years little league this is my first HS season upcomming.I have been working fall ball HS, which I enjoy.Over the weekend I was asked to work a USSSA 16u baseball tourn.The fourth game I worked was the finals somehow and I had the plate.In the first half a batter was hit by a pitch in which I didnt at the time think warranted the award.The batter turned toward the pitch with his bat paralell to the ground it seemed like he was offering his bat to the ball,it was not a full swing and not a bunt as his hands were together.The ball hit him above his hands in his chest. I ruled it a sa strike.I searched youtube hit by pitch and cant find one single instance to support my decision.I have also looked in the OBR rules and cannot find any support. This is bothering me , my partner said I should have given him the base.Does anyone have an example where you would not award first base?Where is this adressed in the rules?

[bob jenkins]

If you thought he was trying to avoid the pitch, give him first.

If you thought he was swinging, call a dead ball strike.

If neither (and the ball was out of the zone), call a dead ball ball.

It sounds as though you saw one thing, your partner saw another. :shrug: IT happens. Based on your partner's input, you can review the play in your mind and perhaps you will see something "different" next time. Or, myabe you'll decide your partner is wrong.

I will say this, though -- very few batters try to get hit in the chest.

[JJ]

Was your first thought "He offered at the pitch"? That should be your first decision. If he DID, it's a strike and the ball's dead (because it hit him). If that was your first thought and you weren't sure, that's when you go to your partner for his thoughts ("Did he go"?).
If you don't think he offered at the pitch, then you have to decide if he initiated contact with the ball - would it have hit him if he hadn't moved, or, did he move into the pitch to get hit deliberately? If he is guilty of that, then the pitch is a ball and he stays up to bat.
If he did not try to get hit, and IS hit, and he didn't offer at the pitch, award him first base.

Your post is a bit unclear - what DID you rule? Strike? Ball? HBP?

JJ

[Richard_Siegel]

It is not uncommon for a new umpire to over-think this rule. Better than 99.9% of the time the batter will be awarded 1B if he is HBP. In over 1300 games behind HP, I think I have kept maybe 10 batters at HP for not trying to get out of the way when they could have and were HBP.

Don't think that the batter must always make an effort to to avoid the pitch. Often that is just not possible. Especially for a new umpire going up to work at HS level ball, you have to realize that some pitches come at the batter so fast he has no chance to avoid the pitch. All he can do is brace for the impact.

We umpires have a special rule that you as a new umpire must embrace. it is: Screw the team that screwed up. If you are not sure of a penalty or award, rule against the team that didn't do the right thing. Pitches do not belong in the batter's box. If a pitcher throws the ball and it hits the batter by accident the pitcher has screwed up. Don't reward the defense by keeping the batter at HP for a HBP if you are not 100% positive the batter COULD have avoided and did not try to avoid it.

Don't think that the batter absolutely must make an effort to to avoid the pitch. What you should think about is: did the batter have the OPPORTUNITY to avoid the pitch? And then: did he make an effort to avoid it? And remember the effort does not have to be a good effort, there just has to be an "effort." Part of the strategy of playing the game is knowing how to take advantage of the other tream's mistakes. If a batter sees that the pitcher has thrown a pitch that might hit him, if he makes a poor effort to avoid it and still gets hits, this is a smart batter. He legally "took one for the team." Any twitch, a turn, a flinch is all it takes to "make and effort" to avoid the pitch. That is how the game is played.

You can't stand there and say top a batter, "you stay at home plate, you could have made a better effort to avoid that pitch." If he made any kind of effort, he gets to go to first base.

When a batter has a slow curve dropping in and he has plenty of time to avoid it but just stands there like a statue and lets it hit him, it will be plain as day to you and everyone else. If the batter moves to purposely put his body where the pitch will hit him, like stick out his elbow, it will be very obvious. That is the HBP where you will keep the batter at HP. If you have a batter attemt to hit the pitch with his bat and he gets hit by the ball, you will know it. If you think he offerred at the pitch, call "time! That's a strike. Batter stay right here." If you think he might have offered and gets hit, call "Time!" then ask your partner, "Did he go?"

Most batter's do not want to get hit by a pitch. Interestingly, in HS ball, I think more batters try to convince me they were NOT hit by a pitch when I saw that they were, then batters who try to let themselves be hit by the pitch just to get the award of 1B. Most batters in HS want to hit the ball with the bat and get on base via a base hit rather than a HBP. They are willing to deny the HBP so they can stay up at bat!

[PeteBooth]

You asked? Where is this addressed in the rules. I know you are new but this rule is not hard to find

OBR 6.08
The batter becomes a runner and is entitled to first base without liability to be put out (provided he advances to and touches first base) when --

(b) He is touched by a pitched ball which he is not attempting to hit unless

(1) The ball is in the strike zone when it touches the batter, or

(2) The batter makes no attempt to avoid being touched by the ball;
If the ball is in the strike zone when it touches the batter, it shall be called a strike, whether or not the batter tries to avoid the ball. If the ball is outside the strike zone when it touches the batter, it shall be called a ball if he makes no attempt to avoid being touched.

APPROVED RULING: When the batter is touched by a pitched ball which does not entitle him to first base, the ball is dead and no runner may advance.

In HS using FED rues, the aforementioned would be under section 7

One difference between FED / OBR is when a player comes to bat and his shirt is loose. In FED we would not award B1 first base if the ball does not touch the batter but part of loose clothing. OBR makes no distinction.

In addition to what Richard said.

What kind of pitch was it? If it's the heat then FULL benefit to B1. I do not know too many batters at the HS level who want to stand there and "take one for the team" when we have a fast ball.

Normally as Richard eluded to if it's a slow curve ball and B1 just stands there and makes no effort is when you would not award B1 first base.

As far as Did B1 Offer at the pitch? - That is simply umpire judgement regardless if your partner agrees with you or not but as mentioned if it's a fast ball give full benefit to B1.

Side Note: My only problem that I have with your OP even though you are new is when you said

Where is this adressed in the rules?

[/

Therefore, I would strongly recommend that you start reading the book and then if you do not undertsand the meaning or application of the rule ask a question but you should do your homework first. As mentioned the rule you are looking for is not that hard to find and most of your questions would have been answered.

Pete Booth

[Steven Tyler]

Don't worry about what kind of pitch it is, worry about batter's intent, or lack of for that matter. So Pete, would you keep a batter at the plate who was batting right and the pitcher was lefty and the ball curve big time into the batter who didn't move. I would hope not.

I only try to determine if the batter was intentionally trying to get hit, or if the pitch that hit him was a strike. A good umpire should easily be able to tell the difference.

Oh yeah, the hands are not, repeat are not, part of the bat.

[officialtony]

He wrote: " Does anyone have an example where you would not award first base? Where is this adressed in the rules? "

Pete you might want to cut him a little slack. If you quote his ENTIRE post,you'll see that he asks about an example of when you WOULDN"T award first base and THEN asks where it is addressed in the rules. It would appear he is asking where in the rules it says you can keep him at the plate? He is looking for some type of explanation that he can give a coach as to why the batter is staying in the box after being hit. I haven't been umpiring as long as many of you, and I read the book 5 to 10 times every season, plus many times I go looking for a specific scenario. But for a new guy to know where to go to find an answer to the question he asked is quite tough.
Just this official's opinion.

[BigUmp56]

There's one other instance in baseball where a batter that's been HBP is not awarded first base, other than the reasons given in 6.08.


Tim.

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally Posted by BigUmp56

There's one other instance in baseball where a batter that's been HBP is not awarded first base, other than the reasons given in 6.08.


Tim.

Would that be if the batter intentionally allows or causes the pitch to hit him?

[BigUmp56]

Originally Posted by SanDiegoSteve

Would that be if the batter intentionally allows or causes the pitch to hit him?

Ummmmmmmmmmmmm.................nope.


Tim.

[UmpJM]

How about if the pitcher balked in his delivery and 1B was "open" or there were "non-consecutive" baserunners.

JM

[BigUmp56]

Originally Posted by UmpJM (nee CoachJM)

How about if the pitcher balked in his delivery and 1B was "open" or there were "non-consecutive" baserunners.

JM

Ummmmmmmmmmmmmmm,...........................yep.


You have to bring him back to the box if all other runners don't advance at least one base.

Tim.

[Steven Tyler]

Originally Posted by BigUmp56

Ummmmmmmmmmmmmmm,...........................yep.


You have to bring him back to the box if all other runners don't advance at least one base.

Tim.

You blew it. If all other runners aren't forced to advance when the hitter is hit by the pitch. Runners cannot advance on a dead ball pitch which what it becomes when it hits the batter. Thus you have to take the results of the balk, not the results of the pitch. Are you clear for take off now.

FED, it doesn't matter. Ball is dead automatically, all runners advance one base regardless.

[BigUmp56]

Your petty little, and I do mean little, insults aside. I didn't blow a darned thing. John mentioned "non consecutive" runners. I didn't think I needed to clarify it any further. Well, at least not to most of the board I didn't.


Tim.

[Steven Tyler]

Originally Posted by BigUmp56

Your petty little, and I do mean little, insults aside. I didn't blow a darned thing. John mentioned "non consecutive" runners. I didn't think I needed to clarify it any further. Well, at least not to most of the board I didn't.


Tim.

I've never heard of "non consecutive" runners. Might be confusing for some. Hopefully everyone, including you, are on the same page now.......