Balk? Coming to Set...

[LMan]

Originally Posted by Don Mueller

8.05
(g) The pitcher makes any motion naturally associated with his pitch while he is not touching the pitcher’s plate;

If he steps on the rubber already set then he made the motion to get set while not touching the pitchers plate. That is by rule a balk.

Coming set is not a pitch. They are seperate actions, thus the rule to make a discernable stop before the delivery (with runners). For example, the definition of 'time of pitch' for the set position is 'when the pitcher separates his hands before delivery' (BRD)

[Don Mueller]

Originally Posted by LMan

Coming set is not a pitch. They are seperate actions, thus the rule to make a discernable stop before the delivery (with runners). For example, the definition of 'time of pitch' for the set position is 'when the pitcher separates his hands before delivery' (BRD)

So are you saying F1 can simulate all preliminary pitching motions up to separating the hands while off the rubber in an attempt to deceive the runner?

[LMan]

Originally Posted by Don Mueller

So are you saying F1 can simulate all preliminary pitching motions up to separating the hands while off the rubber in an attempt to deceive the runner?

Not unless you are saying F1 can't move the ball from the glove to his hand and back (off the rubber) without it being called a pitching motion.

[Don Mueller]

Originally Posted by LMan

Not unless you are saying F1 can't move the ball from the glove to his hand and back (off the rubber) without it being called a pitching motion.

You're conveniently avoiding the question.
It's a yes or no answer
pick one.

[LMan]

Originally Posted by Don Mueller

You're conveniently avoiding the question.
It's a yes or no answer
pick one.

It's never that easy.


The proscription for an illegal quick-pitch requires a pitch to be thrown. That isn't the case here.

F1 cannot take signs off the rubber. The OP says nothing about taking signs, he says he comes set. So, that's out.

You appear to argue that the action of stepping on the rubber and coming set in one act, by itself constitutes 'simulating a pitching motion' and is balkable. This is where we disagree. If coming set were the start of the pitching motion, that is where the rules would state the time of pitch begins. It does not.

The rules DO state that F1 must have his hands separated when assuming the set....now here I think we very probably have a violation, as F1's hands probably join as he touches the rubber. The penalty is 'dont do that' in OBR.

[Don Mueller]

Originally Posted by LMan

It's never that easy.


The proscription for an illegal quick-pitch requires a pitch to be thrown. That isn't the case here.

F1 cannot take signs off the rubber. The OP says nothing about taking signs, he says he comes set. So, that's out.

You appear to argue that the action of stepping on the rubber and coming set in one act, by itself constitutes 'simulating a pitching motion' and is balkable. This is where we disagree. If coming set were the start of the pitching motion, that is where the rules would state the time of pitch begins. It does not.

The rules DO state that F1 must have his hands separated when assuming the set....now here I think we very probably have a violation, as F1's hands probably join as he touches the rubber. The penalty is 'dont do that' in OBR.

I'm saying you cannot simulate a stretch while off the rubber, nor can you simulate being set while off the rubber. Penalty for both is a balk (with runners on)
agree or disagree?

[shickenbottom]

Originally Posted by Don Mueller

I'm saying you cannot simulate a stretch while off the rubber, nor can you simulate being set while off the rubber. Penalty for both is a balk (with runners on) agree or disagree?

DM - Just reading this thread and clearly your missing something:

1st: An OOO is an Overly Officious Official - think of Deputy Barny Fife.

2nd: Please read Rule 8 of OBR. I can copy and post it here if you need, I can also copy the J/R interps of what a balk is and what are legal pitching positions.

3rd: It is not illegal to sumulate the stretch while off the rubber. If it is illegal, please post the rule reference. By the way, the stretch is not a legal pitching position. It is only a prepatory postion prior to comming Set (Legal Pitchin Position). Generally, this is accepted that the pitcher is in contact, but he doesn't have to be.

4th: It is not illegal to simulate the set postion from off the rubber. If it is illegal, please post the rule reference. 8.05g specifically states that it is illegal make any motion naturally associated with the pitch from off the rubber. Simulating a Set postion is not a pitch. The time of the pitch begins when the pitcher begins his motion.