Help Me Out Here...

bossman72 · #1 (**permalink**) Thu Jul 20, 2006, 09:26pm

I need to settle an argument with an umpire in my association:

Coach tells the catcher (and says only this- from the dugout): "Go talk to the pitcher."

My friend in the assocation thinks this is a trip as per 8.06 comment. I don't think so. How can i prove that it's not?

By the black and white letter of the law in OBR, he's technically right, but i don't think that's what the spirit of the rule intended.

umpduck11 · #2 (**permalink**) Thu Jul 20, 2006, 11:06pm

I don't see that he is right, technically or otherwise. 8.06 comment says
"If the manager or coach goes to the catcher or infielder.....". I do
not equate "goes" with telling him from the dugout. If all the coach says
is "go talk to the pitcher", he hasn't given F2 any strategy to discuss. I
don't see circumvention on the rules here.

DG · #3 (**permalink**) Thu Jul 20, 2006, 11:18pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by bossman72

I need to settle an argument with an umpire in my association:

Coach tells the catcher (and says only this- from the dugout): "Go talk to the pitcher."

My friend in the assocation thinks this is a trip as per 8.06 comment. I don't think so. How can i prove that it's not?

By the black and white letter of the law in OBR, he's technically right, but i don't think that's what the spirit of the rule intended.

Your umpire associate is incorrect. Why do you need to prove it? Does your association have an official rules interpreter?

bossman72 · #4 (**permalink**) Fri Jul 21, 2006, 12:03am

Quote:

Originally Posted by DG

Your umpire associate is incorrect. Why do you need to prove it? Does your association have an official rules interpreter?

Yes, and he agrees with me, but the guy i'm trying to convince is stubborn.

bobbybanaduck · #5 (**permalink**) Fri Jul 21, 2006, 05:06am

he can be as stubborn as he likes, but he will be wrong.

ozzy6900 · #6 (**permalink**) Fri Jul 21, 2006, 06:14am

The coach says to F2, "Go talk to the pitcher!".

Here's what you tell your friend. Unless F2 is conveying a message from the coach to F1, there is no trip charged. In order to charge a trip, the coach would have to give F2 information to give to F1. Just saying "Go talk to the pitcher!" is not conveying information (such as what to throw, where to throw).

You may also suggest to your friend that he should get himself better acquainted with the rules before he umpires any more children's games!

gsf23 · #7 (**permalink**) Fri Jul 21, 2006, 07:37am

When I read the original post one thing popped into my mind, Pete Rose.

I seem to remember a long time ago when Pete Rose was a player/manager, there was a big deal made about this. Rose was in the field playing first and signaled for his shortstop to go to the mound. The homeplate umpire saw Rose pointing and motioning for the shortstop to go to the mound and charged him with a conference. There was a big argument and Rose may have been tossed, can't remember if he was or not. If anyone else can remember this or clarify the situation that would be great.

bossman72 · #8 (**permalink**) Fri Jul 21, 2006, 01:47pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by ozzy6900

The coach says to F2, "Go talk to the pitcher!".

Here's what you tell your friend. Unless F2 is conveying a message from the coach to F1, there is no trip charged. In order to charge a trip, the coach would have to give F2 information to give to F1. Just saying "Go talk to the pitcher!" is not conveying information (such as what to throw, where to throw).

You may also suggest to your friend that he should get himself better acquainted with the rules before he umpires any more children's games!

Sounds like a good one.

Funny thing is: my associate made this incorrect ruling in a game- the ruling was protested, and he lost. I was trying to explain that to him, but he interprets 8.06 the way he wants to.