Worst Coach Tirade Ever?

[BlueLawyer]

This is one tirade, granted. But on that video I saw:

1. An argument with a safe/out call that lasted too long.
2. Sliding into the second base bag, showing the umpire up.
3. Going to home plate and kicking dirt on the plate until it was completely covered.
4. Pouring the bottle of water on to the plate, making a mudpie.
5. Throwing bats out of the dugout.

I'm probably missing something here.

Any one of these 5, taken separately, was worth dumping him. So, in essence, he gets dumped 5 times, plus an extra two. I'd say 10 games, at least, without pay, plus the fine.

It's subjective, I know. Sometimes it makes no rhyme or reason. Stackhouse gets called for an ordinary foul on Shaq. He's suspended. This idiot makes a mockery of the game and he sits for a week.

Strikes and outs!

[Sal Giaco]

Originally Posted by SCUMP

sal i agree with a lot of what you said but the pu was not even in ear shot.

also i do not think that the managers tirade would have lasted three mins if the pu had made an attempt to remove the manager by stepping in. even at the big league level you see it all the time, after the ejection and the manager has his say one or more of the umpires steps in to try to difuse the situation.

Not really - click on the link below and follow it down to where it says MORE COVERAGE: Young and Showalter get ejected.

http://mlb.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/news/g...=.jsp&c_id=tex

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by BlueLawyer

It's subjective, I know. Sometimes it makes no rhyme or reason. Stackhouse gets called for an ordinary foul on Shaq. He's suspended. This idiot makes a mockery of the game and he sits for a week.

Ordinary foul? If that was a HS game at the very least you would have an intentional foul for the Stackhouse/Shaq contact. I do not know too many people that would argue if you decided to make that contact a flagrant foul. The NBA has rules for flagrant fouls and suspensions are automatic if the foul is considered to be a "Flagrant 2 Foul." We cannot compare a very strict rule in one sport to why someone got suspended in another sport. The NFL gives out suspensions and fines for things that were not even called during the game. Apples and oranges if you ask me.

Peace

[lawump]

Originally Posted by BlueLawyer

Any one of these 5, taken separately, was worth dumping him. So, in essence, he gets dumped 5 times, plus an extra two. I'd say 10 games, at least, without pay, plus the fine.

It's subjective, I know. Sometimes it makes no rhyme or reason. Stackhouse gets called for an ordinary foul on Shaq. He's suspended. This idiot makes a mockery of the game and he sits for a week.

Strikes and outs!

Oh, none of you have had the pleasure of calling Mr. Moss (SAL President for life) after a non-routine ejection have you?

For if you have, then you would be SHOCKED that he got 7 days and $1,000. I'm thinking it was only that long and that high because of the black eye the league took in the media.

Here's a sample of my dealings with Mr. Moss.

(Facts: I called the lead-off hitter for visiting Asheville out on strikes (3 pitches, 3 called strikes) to start the game. I called him out on strikes to end the third inning with runners on base (3 pitches, 3 called strikes). He took 5 fastballs and a breaking ball...and none were close to being a "ball".

He goes into the dugout, starts yelling, tosses his helmet onto the field...at which point I dump him. He comes running out of the dugout, bumps me, has to be restrained by his teammates, goes and throws a gatorade cooler onto the field and then leaves.

Because this is "non-routine" (bumping) I just can't write the report...I have to call the league President.

Here is a paraphrase of my conversation with Mr. Moss.

Me: "Mr. Moss, I'm calling to report a non-routine incident on the field today in Charleston (home team)."

Mr. Moss (in a thick southern drawl): "Yes, I've already heard about it."

Me: "Good sir. Then you know I was bumped today."

Mr. Moss: "Son, what in the hell are you doing to my league?"

Me: "Excuse me sir?"

Mr. Moss: "Was the player in the dugout when you ejected him?"

Me: "Well, yes sir. He tossed his helmet onto the field from the dugout."

Mr. Moss: "But he was in the dugout?"

Me: "Yes sir."

Mr. Moss: "We don't need to go looking for troubles in the dugout. I don't want you tossing people from the dugout."

Me: "Yes sir. Good-bye sir."

[hangs up phone]

Me (to partner in the room): "Its going to be a long season."

[BlueLawyer]

I agree, and that's why I acknowledge the subjective nature of the suspension.

But Rut, do you think Mikulik got enough?

Strikes and outs!

[BlueLawyer]

Originally Posted by lawump

Me: "Well, yes sir. He tossed his helmet onto the field from the dugout."

Mr. Moss: "But he was in the dugout?"

Me: "Yes sir."

Mr. Moss: "We don't need to go looking for troubles in the dugout. I don't want you tossing people from the dugout."

Come, on, counselor. Are you telling me that story with a straight face? The jackass throws stuff OUT OF THE DUGOUT and on to the field and your LP tells you you are looking for trouble?

I believe you, by the way. And frankly, it illuminates the whole sad situation.

Strikes and outs!

[SCUMP]

sal it is pretty obvious that the pu was not in ear shot by watching the video.

im sure we can agree on this.

maybe in those vides you mentioned no ump stepped in. but in the majority of cases i would bet a fellow umpire would step in, to at least make an attempt to try to difuse the situation.

at least if the pu had been closer i doubt the manager would have walked past him to put on a show at the plate.

[socalblue1]

The OLD School method at work!

http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=stor...5ff221cae1e5ad

[Sal Giaco]

Originally Posted by SCUMP

sal it is pretty obvious that the pu was not in ear shot by watching the video.

im sure we can agree on this.

maybe in those vides you mentioned no ump stepped in. but in the majority of cases i would bet a fellow umpire would step in, to at least make an attempt to try to difuse the situation.

at least if the pu had been closer i doubt the manager would have walked past him to put on a show at the plate.

I understand where you're coming for brother. I know, as well as you do, that pro ball arguments can be tricky to handle, ie. when to step in and when to leave your partner on his own.

As I posted before, generally speaking, when a heated discussion is going on, the nearest umpire should walk (don't jog/run over towards the argument) and get in the vicinity to wear you can hear what's be said. Keep other coaches/players away from the discussion but don't involve yourself either. When the ejection happens, let the guys have their final say and then move in if necessary.

That's my own personal opinion and guideline on handling arguments. Every situation is different and how I handle things in the Spring (NCAA) and how I go about things in the Summer (Indy Pro ball) are usually not the same.

[SCUMP]

i like that socblu... at least he's showing bucky he has a back bone......

[SCUMP]

point well made. sal

[FitUmp]

Originally Posted by SanDiegoSteve

I must say I agree with PDX, WWTB, and the rest of the guys on this side of the debate. For weeks all we heard was how great the AMLU umpires are, and how when they come back everything will be just Jim Dandy, and the scabs don't have any game management skills. Now we see that the managers and players are no more enamoured with the regular guys than they were with the replacements. Everything is not rosy peachy keen as advertised, and the games are not running smooth as silk upon the return of the minor league umpires.

Anybody who doesn't see the irony in this is not looking at it without bias.

Or brains.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by BlueLawyer

I agree, and that's why I acknowledge the subjective nature of the suspension.

But Rut, do you think Mikulik got enough?

Strikes and outs!

I am assuming Mikulik is the guys that had the tirade. (That we are talking about) If that is who you are talking about, I personally do not care either way. For one this is the Minor Leagues and Class A ball at that. He did not contact the umpires from what I saw. He does not make millions like the MLB Managers do. He got 7 days and fined $1000 which is probably more of his salary than most fines with other players and managers at the higher levels. Without knowing his salary or precedent from other incidents at that level, I have no idea if he got enough.

Peace

[FitUmp]

Originally Posted by lawump

Oh, none of you have had the pleasure of calling Mr. Moss (SAL President for life) after a non-routine ejection have you?

Sure have.

Originally Posted by lawump

For if you have, then you would be SHOCKED that he got 7 days and $1,000.

Sure are.

(snipped remainder)

The man is addled in the head.

[Bainer]

Originally Posted by ctblu40

BTW- in umpire school, these guys are instructed on how to handle situations. The training includes the instructors going mental, as well as other things such as batters charging mound, bench clears, ect.

This is true. I remember going over this for a few days at the school. Also, and more specific to this situation, at one of our National Camps, during the on-field session, they addressed this sort of thing specifically:
Hearing 'through the grapevine' that one of the attendees had been party to a serious blowup, they waited until he was on-field, and the instructor threw it all at him. At first, we stood around gasping and laughing hysterically, but it wouldn't stop! The instructor took all three bases back to the dugout, buried the rubber, tried to dig up the plate, threw his hat OVER the backstop, ran around and asked EACH PLAYER in the field about the call, and more! The ump remained still and silent, as the BU in this situation did, each time rotating around to face the coach when he returned to yell. After about 10 minutes (honestly), the instructor stopped cold. He walked calmly over to the ump and said "at what point are you going to do something? I can do this all day." But the real lesson came when he turned to address the other umpire. He looked him in the eye and said "Where were you? I didn't see you once. Get your a$$ next to your partner and don't let him out of arm's reach. "
Sadly, the post-mortem on the incident happened behind closed doors, so we didn't get to hear what the instructors would have considered the 'perfect course of action', but needless to say, it wasn't the mannequin approach.

Bainer.