Fair/Foul from position A or D

[smac1231]

Looking for some help on a screamer down the line while I'm in A or D ...

In pregame we cover it: UIC has the ball to the bag (or to the cutout, depending on who you're working with); U1 or U3 has it past that point. The base (or cut) is like a windowpane ... if it breaks the glass, U1 or U3 has the call. Fine, understood.

I've been doing games for a long time, but it seems like now that I'm at the college level (JUCO), I'm seeing a lot more screamers/hookers. Go figure.

Had a game the other day, with that situation. I'm in A, nobody on. Lefty yanks an inside pitch. 2-hopper right at me. 1B is slightly in front of me, but takes a deep angle on the ball. No contact is made, but I get "pushed" out of position a couple of steps further into foul territory. I watch the ball hook over the bag as this is going on.

I bang it Fair and head down the line to make sure everything is okay in the bullpen area since it's rolling that direction. Two steps down the line, I hear my UIC calling it foul.

Yeah ... we cross-called it. Not good. Yeah, we heard it. Yeah, we talked about it in postgame, and he said he screwed it, that he shouldn't have called it. He did think I had gotten "pushed" out of position, so he took it.

1 - Question ... Am I understanding the "UIC takes it to the bag, U1/U3 takes it after, correctly?
2 - Comment ... I'd much rather see a change in mechanic: UIC takes ground balls between Plate and Bag, U1 or U3 takes anything in the air (line drive or fly), but maybe it's just me ...

Mac

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by smac1231

I've been doing games for a long time, but it seems like now that I'm at the college level (JUCO), I'm seeing a lot more screamers/hookers.

We usually refer to them as "coaches / coeds"

1 - Question ... Am I understanding the "UIC takes it to the bag, U1/U3 takes it after, correctly?

Yes -- you understand it correctly.

[2rad4u]

This is how I work it as PU.

If it's in front of the BU, I have it. I ground ball should belong to the PU.

If a fly ball drops behind the BU, he has it.

In your sitch, I would have made the call from the plate. You don't need to be calling that ball as your moving anyway.

My .02

[BigUmp56]

From A or D the BU has the bag and beyond. On any ball bounding anywhere near the bag the BU should be the only one making a call. He has the ball and the bag right there in front of him. I don't see why the PU would ever make this call if it was that close.


Tim.

[2rad4u]

Who has a better look, a BU moving to avoid being hit by the ball, or the PU standing still straddling the line.

I'll take that call.

[ozzy6900]

You stated that it was a "2 hopper right at you". This means that the PU has the fair/foul call all the way because it is a bounding ball not a line drive or fly ball.

In this case, I point to the PU and say "you got it John". I then head out to follow the play in case the ball goes into a dead ball area.

[smac1231]

Originally Posted by ozzy6900

You stated that it was a "2 hopper right at you". This means that the PU has the fair/foul call all the way because it is a bounding ball not a line drive or fly ball.

In this case, I point to the PU and say "you got it John". I then head out to follow the play in case the ball goes into a dead ball area.

Yes, bounding ball.

IMO, a bounding ball SHOULD be called by the UIC. But our mechanics books say otherwise.

I like the communication piece above, Ozzy.

2rad4u, to clarify, I wasn't making the call WHILE moving. I had a good look, stepped in, banged it Fair and moved down the line. But I see your (and others') point ... we're moving in that situation, one direction or the other ... UIC is stationary and has a better look.

BTW ... no fault to my UIC on this call. We talked about it afterwards. He said he thought I was pushed out of position, so he took it.

The mistake I made, was to not make eye contact or communicate with him after getting "pushed."

Mac

[briancurtin]

Originally Posted by smac1231

now that I'm at the college level (JUCO), I'm seeing a lot more screamers/hookers. Go figure.

sounds like you have some pretty exotic colleges in your area

[BigUmp56]

Originally Posted by 2rad4u

Who has a better look, a BU moving to avoid being hit by the ball, or the PU standing still straddling the line.

I'll take that call.

I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and say as the PU you made it ten feet up the line before you made the call. Remember this is a shot that the BU says he had a hard time getting out of the way from being hit, so ten feet is generous. That puts you 80' away from the bag to make this call. Now, what makes you think you can see the ball bound over or in front of the bag when it's that close better than the BU who just slid to his left further into foul territory and is right on top of it?


Tim.

[2rad4u]

Who do you think makes that call when BU is in B or C?

[BigUmp56]

How does that equate to you being only 20' feet away from the play with the proper angle from A or D?


Tim.

[2rad4u]

I'm just stating the fact that the PU has to be prepared for this kind of call, anytime. It's the PU's call when the BU is in A, as it is when the BU is in B or C.

It's the PU's call. It's a GROUND BALL for goodness sake, not a fly ball. The fair/foul needs to be called at the bag, not beyond.

The PU is looking up the line, the BU is off the line.

[SanDiegoSteve]

In B or C, well duh......it's the PU's call on all fair/foul. But when BU is in A or D, the PU has all fair/foul calls up to the base. Once it either hits the base or passes the base, it becomes the BU's call. Standard mechanic ever since I can recall. Bounding balls, rolling balls, line drives, whatever. Even if the BU has to dodge the baseball, the call is still his responsibility.

Also, the BU in A has responsibility on balls that take F4 toward the 1st base line, and all plays of F3 except on pop-ups around 1st base, where the BU comes in and pivots and the PU takes the ball.

[smac1231]

2rad4u ...

This is exactly where we need to clarify things. I've always been taught that if the ball (bounding or in the air) goes PAST the bag, U1/U3 has the call.

But my heart and my head agree with you. On a bounding ball that screams past the bag, the fair/foul call is AT the bag ... thus belonging to the UIC.

BigUmp ...

True, U1/U3 are closer on that play, but does that really mean they have a better view? Camps teach to stay back to get a better look at the big picture in most other situations, wouldn't the same apply here - giving way to the UIC to make the call?

Just throwing out ideas on a rainy day here.

Mac

[BigUmp56]

Originally Posted by smac1231

2rad4u ...

BigUmp ...

True, U1/U3 are closer on that play, but does that really mean they have a better view? Camps teach to stay back to get a better look at the big picture in most other situations, wouldn't the same apply here - giving way to the UIC to make the call?

Just throwing out ideas on a rainy day here.

Mac

Mac:

I have to say that the BU does have a much better look at a ball bounding over the bag. I would imagine that's why every camp or clinic I've been to says it the BU's call when in A or D. Granted the PU has to make this call when the BU is in B or C, but as Carl always says, coverage is a matter of sacrifices.

Tim.