Question on Awards with Tagging up

[Justme]

Originally Posted by mrniceguy

Good question. Answer: 2 bases TOP from last entitled base.

Did I get it right?

No you didn't. It's 2 bases from the Time of Throw (TOT) not Time of Pitch (TOP), in this situation. TOP is when F1 delivers the pitch and TOT is when the fielder throws the ball in. Also, it's not 2 bases from the last entitled base, it's 2 bases from the last base legally acquired prior to the throw.

The runner has to re-touch the base too.

[mcrowder]

To extend this, if the runner on 1st had passed SECOND base when this ball was uncorked toward first, and then into DBT, the runner gets HOME (and it's up to him to know he has to go retouch). Two bases from TIME OF THROW.

[BigUmp56]

Originally Posted by mcrowder

To extend this, if the runner on 1st had passed SECOND base when this ball was uncorked toward first, and then into DBT, the runner gets HOME (and it's up to him to know he has to go retouch). Two bases from TIME OF THROW.

My response was in line with Mike's. I would say that just because they threw behind the runner they have yet to make an unmistakeable appeal. So, if R1 had reached or had passed second base before TOT. I would award home and wait for a proper appeal. He has legally obtained second until properly appealed. I see your point that this could have been considered an erred appeal though which would disallow a second appeal.


Tim.

[Justme]

Originally Posted by PWL

Go up and read my earlier posts. I said two bases from time of throw from last legally obtained base. Runner has not legally obtained 2B without tagging up. Two base award from 1B, thus his award would be 3B. Runner must go back and re-tag 1B, touch 2B and 3B. If he does not do this defense is entitled to appeal, which must be done properly.

Just that simple.

Just for the sake of discussion let me ask these questions.

Since a missed base or failure to tag up is an appeal how could you justify awarding 3B and not home in this situation? Wouldn't your base award indicate that the runner didn't tag up? Especially since the offensive coach would probably ask you why his player didn't get 2 bases from 2B.

If the failure to tag up isn't appealed then it didn't happen right?

[BigUmp56]

Originally Posted by PWL

I'm not the base coach. Remember he still has to retreat by touching 2B on his way back to tag up.

I take it you're not familiar with the "last time by" concept.

Originally Posted by PWL

They can even appeal this. A dead ball doesn't release the runner from properly running the bases. If the defense doesn't appeal it by putting the ball in play for example, they lost their chance.

Since when did the defense start putting the ball back into play?

You cannot call the runner out for failure to properly tag. The defense is responsible for making a proper appeal. If they don't. Then your right, it didn't happen.[/QUOTE]

Okay, so then the award should have been to home until a proper appeal.


Tim.

[mcrowder]

Originally Posted by PWL

Go up and read my earlier posts. I said two bases from time of throw from last legally obtained base. Runner has not legally obtained 2B without tagging up. Two base award from 1B, thus his award would be 3B. Runner must go back and re-tag 1B, touch 2B and 3B. If he does not do this defense is entitled to appeal, which must be done properly.

Just that simple.

Not correct. Runner HAS legally obtained 2nd base - was there an illegal act here? No, just bad baserunning... not ILLEGAL baserunning.

[UMP25]

Keep this in mind when figuring out TOT and TOP: It is always TOT when an outfielder is the one throwing the ball, such as the play referenced in this thread.

TOT or TOP refers to when the throw was released from the fielder's hands. The exception would be on certain deflections or certain intentional acts by a fielder.