Verbal Mechanics

[LDUB]

Originally posted by BigUmp56
I think it's going to be pretty easy to explain to the offensive coach.

Coach: "Why didn't you score the run, there was no one there to field the throw?"

Me: "Well, Skip, if your batter didn't clock him in the back of the head then the catcher wouldn't be on the ground unable to field the throw."

Tim.

How about you join SDS in the list of guys who go around making up rules. There are rules that deal with what to do if B1 intentionally hits F2. In the play described, that was not the case. F2 got hurt. It is not your job to penalize the offense because a defensive player got injured.

[BigUmp56]

I provided you with the rule. Now you're sounding like a rat. After the play is killed it's up to the judgement of the umpire to place the runners. There's no rule defining judgement.

Tim.

[LDUB]

Originally posted by BigUmp56
I provided you with the rule. Now you're sounding like a rat. After the play is killed it's up to the judgement of the umpire to place the runners. There's no rule defining judgement.

Tim.

There is no rule defining judgement, but your judgement sucks.

Here is what is happened:

F2 laying face down.
No one else near plate.
R2 rounding third base.

How is R2 not going to score? Who is going to tag him out?

Also...You are the rat like one, you called time to protect a player, who may or may not have been in jeapordy.

[mcrowder]

I wish you two would find a room.

[BigUmp56]

Time can, and should be called in this situation. Common sense and fair play (which you lack) would dictate that you wouldn't reward the offense on this play by advancing R2 after you killed the play.

If trying to protect a teenager from futher injury makes me a rat, then I will gladly accept the title.

Tim.

[Edited by BigUmp56 on Jan 20th, 2006 at 02:48 PM]

[BigUmp56]

In the words of the infamous Tee:

PWL= WOBW

Tim.

[Tim C]

I cannot picture any experienced "FED" umpire not scoring the run.

Period.

What a crock!

Tee

[BigUmp56]

I can't picture an "experienced" Fed umpire not knowing there was a rule allowing the play to be killed.

Tim.

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally posted by LDUB

There is no rule defining judgement, but your judgement sucks.

Here is what is happened:

F2 laying face down.
No one else near plate.
R2 rounding third base.

How is R2 not going to score? Who is going to tag him out?

Also...You are the rat like one, you called time to protect a player, who may or may not have been in jeapordy.

Luke,

How do you equate protecting a player's safety to being a coach. You shouldn't swear at people like that!

And Tim, you shouldn't call Luke a rat either. Gentlemen, please!

Here is what happened:

F2 was hit on the head with the full force of the follow-through of the bat. He is laying on top of home plate, and is not getting up.

This happened when R2 was leading off from 2nd base, not as he was rounding third. Sitch was not worded accurately to start with.

F8 possibly had a play on R2 at the plate, as he was coming up throwing as R2 rounded third.

F2 was still down, many seconds after originally going down, so he appears to be possibly unconscious.

At this point I kill the ball, with the rules backing me up in a high school game, and with 9.01(c) in an OBR based youth game.

When the paramedics come and take the catcher away with a cerebral hemmorage or other serious injury, I don't want his mother jumping my *** for letting the play continue. What if F3 cuts the throw off and puts the BR in a run-down between 1st and 2nd, and it goes on for a bit longer? Meanwhile, the catcher is getting no medical attention, which he may very well need at this point.

This is not pro ball, and you can't umpire amateur youth ball games as though it were.

[bob jenkins]

Originally posted by LDUB

There is no rule defining judgement, but your judgement sucks.

Here is what is happened:

F2 laying face down.
No one else near plate.
R2 rounding third base.

How is R2 not going to score? Who is going to tag him out?

Also...You are the rat like one, you called time to protect a player, who may or may not have been in jeapordy.

It sounds to me like F2 is blocking the plate while not in posession of the ball (or about to recieve a throw) -- I'd rule obstruction and award the run.

Now, change the play so R2 rounds third just as the F3 fields the throw from the outfield. F2 and F3 converge on the plate and the injured F2. Here, I'd be more likely to kill the play and return R2 to third.

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally posted by bob jenkins

It sounds to me like F2 is blocking the plate while not in posession of the ball (or about to recieve a throw) -- I'd rule obstruction and award the run.

Now, change the play so R2 rounds third just as the F3 fields the throw from the outfield. F2 and F3 converge on the plate and the injured F2. Here, I'd be more likely to kill the play and return R2 to third.

Bob,

The runner was rounding third as F8 was throwing the ball. What makes you think there wasn't going to be a train wreck at the plate. I can picture F1 trying to pull F2 off the plate to make a play.

Like I said if this was adult league baseball, I let the play continue. I sure don't want the liability of letting the play go on with a minor child possibly seriously injured sprawled across the plate.

And how could that be obstruction when R2 is still rounding third? Are you awarding "imaginary obstruction" because there may be a play at the plate? I would think you would have to wait and see if F2 hasn't been rolled out of the way.

Killing the play and putting the runners at first and third just makes more sense. If the play had read, "the catcher was hit in the head, but got up as R2 was rounding 3rd" then I would let the play continue.

[Tim C]

Excuse me Tim, where did I ever say anything about not knowing a rule that for safety the ball can be killed?

Direct me to that post, please.

As I said, I cannot believe that an experienced FED umpire would not score the run. It is that simple.

Tee

[GarthB]

Originally posted by BigUmp56
I can't picture an "experienced" Fed umpire not knowing there was a rule allowing the play to be killed.

Tim.

You are setting up conditions that do not necessarily exist. Scoring the run doesn't mean one doesn't know that a rule exists allowing the play to be killed. It means, simply, scoring the run.

[LDUB]

Originally posted by BigUmp56
Time can, and should be called in this situation. Common sense and fair play (which you lack) would dictate that you wouldn't reward the offense on this play by advancing R2 after you killed the play.

If trying to protect a teenager from futher injury makes me a rat, then I will gladly accept the title.

1. A TEENAGE baserunner will see that F2 is knocked out and covering up the plate. He will also see that F2 does not have the ball. Do you think R2 is going to do some sort of slide right into the catcher's face?

2. Common sense says R2 will score when there is no one at the plate to make a play on him.

[BigUmp56]

Originally posted by Tim C
There is no chance that I would ever do what SDS suggests:

Play continues under all codes with shaving aged players.

No matter what SDS "wants" to do I call games by the rules.

There is no rule nor logic that allows SDS to make his call.

That is why, I guess, that he thinks he "could have been an MLB umpire."

I guess this play alone shows that to be incorrect.

Tee

I guess I misunderstood when I read what you had written.

Tim.