Can I Make this Call?

[tmp44]

In the era of "getting it right," can I make this call?

FED varsity. Top of the 5th, Visiting Team down 4-3. They have an R2 with 0 outs. B1 lays down a bunt down the 1st base line that is fairly close to the line. I'm PU and come out of the box quickly for a potential very close fair/foul call. F1 fields the ball in fair territory and tags BR. From the angle I had by coming up the line to make the fair/foul call, F1 made a successful tag, and I immeidately called BR out on the tag. Visiting HC argued the call with me, although he eventually accepted my explanation.

Looking back I realize that I probably "stepped on the toes" of my partner. Making the tag call was basically a reaction 1) seeing the tag occur and 2) knowing that I had a better angle and closer distance than my partner in the C. Should I still have not made any call though? Or can the PU make the call in this situation?

[bob jenkins]

Before the running lane starts, the tag belongs to the PU.

After the running lane starts, the tag belongs to the BU.

[jicecone]

Originally posted by tmp44
In the era of "getting it right," can I make this call?

FED varsity. Top of the 5th, Visiting Team down 4-3. They have an R2 with 0 outs. B1 lays down a bunt down the 1st base line that is fairly close to the line. I'm PU and come out of the box quickly for a potential very close fair/foul call. F1 fields the ball in fair territory and tags BR. From the angle I had by coming up the line to make the fair/foul call, F1 made a successful tag, and I immeidately called BR out on the tag. Visiting HC argued the call with me, although he eventually accepted my explanation.

Looking back I realize that I probably "stepped on the toes" of my partner. Making the tag call was basically a reaction 1) seeing the tag occur and 2) knowing that I had a better angle and closer distance than my partner in the C. Should I still have not made any call though? Or can the PU make the call in this situation?

Not only can he, he should. Usually you have that tag up to the 45 foot lane however, witha runner at second and your partner in the "C" position, the PU has the BEST view of this and SHOULD make the call.

[DG]

Originally posted by tmp44
In the era of "getting it right," can I make this call?

FED varsity. Top of the 5th, Visiting Team down 4-3. They have an R2 with 0 outs. B1 lays down a bunt down the 1st base line that is fairly close to the line. I'm PU and come out of the box quickly for a potential very close fair/foul call. F1 fields the ball in fair territory and tags BR. From the angle I had by coming up the line to make the fair/foul call, F1 made a successful tag, and I immeidately called BR out on the tag. Visiting HC argued the call with me, although he eventually accepted my explanation.

Looking back I realize that I probably "stepped on the toes" of my partner. Making the tag call was basically a reaction 1) seeing the tag occur and 2) knowing that I had a better angle and closer distance than my partner in the C. Should I still have not made any call though? Or can the PU make the call in this situation?

You have fair/foul and R2's touch at 3rd. You should only be up the line slightly because you have to observe touch at 3B also, and be ready to return to the plate. Once the ball is picked up fair point fair and observe the rest of the play so if your partner asks for help you can. But it's not your call.

[tmp44]

Originally posted by DG

You have fair/foul and R2's touch at 3rd. You should only be up the line slightly because you have to observe touch at 3B also, and be ready to return to the plate. Once the ball is picked up fair point fair and observe the rest of the play so if your partner asks for help you can. But it's not your call.

DG,

I see your point about the touch at 3rd and this is what my quandry was (BTW, I only went up the line about 15 feet so I would have been fine for a play at the plate). But you also make the point about watching the rest of the play in case my partner needs help...well how can I do that and watch R2 at the same time?

[scyguy]

just my opinion, but you did fine. Make the call if it is before the 45. DG is right that you need the touch at 3B, but in two-man, sometimes you cannot cover everything. Which is more important, the tag on BR or R2's touch of third? Remember, it is likely that you can do both. "Out on the tag", then quick adjustment to pick up R2's touch of third. It is important, however, to remember not to go up the 1st base line very far since you have R2 at second at TOP

[DG]

Originally posted by scyguy
just my opinion, but you did fine. Make the call if it is before the 45. DG is right that you need the touch at 3B, but in two-man, sometimes you cannot cover everything. Which is more important, the tag on BR or R2's touch of third? Remember, it is likely that you can do both. "Out on the tag", then quick adjustment to pick up R2's touch of third. It is important, however, to remember not to go up the 1st base line very far since you have R2 at second at TOP

The most important call for PU in this play is fair/foul, and after that he is going to have to be quick to see touch at 3B and help out on swipe at 1B if needed. And while the points made about the 45 foot line are true, it never dawned on me that F1 could field a bunt up the 1B line and still be in a position to tag a runner who as not made 45 feet yet.

[DG]

Originally posted by scyguy
just my opinion, but you did fine. Make the call if it is before the 45. DG is right that you need the touch at 3B, but in two-man, sometimes you cannot cover everything. Which is more important, the tag on BR or R2's touch of third? Remember, it is likely that you can do both. "Out on the tag", then quick adjustment to pick up R2's touch of third. It is important, however, to remember not to go up the 1st base line very far since you have R2 at second at TOP

Be quick with the head turns. You may have to make more than one. It's really not a big deal to me if I am the BU and you make this call. We are a team.

[ChapJim]

Remember your priorities.

1. Fair/foul
2. Catch/no-catch
3. Plays on the ball
4. Plays away from the ball.

You handled #1 and #3. #2 was not applicable. The touch and any play at third was a #4. Your partner should know that he can't help much with the little dribbler on the 1b line. He ought to be able to handle whatever R2 is doing.

[PeteBooth]

Originally posted by ChapJim

Remember your priorities.

1. Fair/foul
2. Catch/no-catch
3. Plays on the ball
4. Plays away from the ball.

You handled #1 and #3. #2 was not applicable. The touch and any play at third was a #4. Your partner should know that he can't help much with the little dribbler on the 1b line. He ought to be able to handle whatever R2 is doing.

Just to be clear

Your first Priority as PU is to call the Pitch (strike / ball)

Then IF the ball is HIT
1. Fair/Foul, EXCEPTION:

No-one on base BU in "A" and a screamer down the right field line, then the PU has fair / Foul up to the bag and the BU will take the Fair / Foul call Past the bag.

2. If there is a play as described, then the PU has:
A. possible Interfernce call involving the 45 ft. lane rule
B. Tag Play BEFORE 45ft. lane rule

Think of it this way,

B1 attempts a drag bunt and is a good foot or 2 out of the box and the ball hits him. Whose call is that?

Answer it's the PU's call

therefore, on this play as Bob mentioned if it's before 45ft. then it's the PU's call.

If the ball is hit to the outfield it depends

BU in position "A" , Pu has Catch / No Catch to the left of the right fielder.

BU in "B" / "C" then the BU has Catch / No Catch in the "V", PU has the lines

After that depends upon the mechanics of one's association and the all important PRE-Game

Pete Booth

[ChapJim]

Peter, if you want to look at it like that, your first priority is to get to the field on time.

Sheez! We're talking about a batted ball and you want to talk about balls and strikes?

[mcrowder]

Jim - your first priority is to get your Umpiring certification. Then proper equipment... etc.

PS - it's Peter. Get used to it. Read past the nits, there's always a kernel of information in his posts.

[Rich]

Originally posted by tmp44
In the era of "getting it right," can I make this call?

FED varsity. Top of the 5th, Visiting Team down 4-3. They have an R2 with 0 outs. B1 lays down a bunt down the 1st base line that is fairly close to the line. I'm PU and come out of the box quickly for a potential very close fair/foul call. F1 fields the ball in fair territory and tags BR. From the angle I had by coming up the line to make the fair/foul call, F1 made a successful tag, and I immeidately called BR out on the tag. Visiting HC argued the call with me, although he eventually accepted my explanation.

Looking back I realize that I probably "stepped on the toes" of my partner. Making the tag call was basically a reaction 1) seeing the tag occur and 2) knowing that I had a better angle and closer distance than my partner in the C. Should I still have not made any call though? Or can the PU make the call in this situation?

I'm coming across and getting an angle on that and then my plate umpire partner makes a call that doesn't belong to him? Of course I'm going to be annoyed. What Bob said -- up to the running lane, yours. After the running lane, mine.

Stop thinking you can't call this starting in C. By the time the call is made, the base umpire should be nowhere near the C position.