NFHS baseball courstey runners

[DanSummers]

If # 24 runs for catcher in 1st inning, can another player(s) who has not been in game run for the catcher if he gets on the next time, or is # 24 locked in????

[bob jenkins]

Originally posted by DanSummers
If # 24 runs for catcher in 1st inning, can another player(s) who has not been in game run for the catcher if he gets on the next time, or is # 24 locked in????

Anyone who is otherwise eligible can be the CR for the catcher later in the game.

The team does not need to use any CR later in the game, if they so choose.

#24 cannot be the CR for the pitcher, once he has run for the catcher.

[BJ Moose]

Bob is, of course, correct. I wonder how many FED umps REALLY know this (or was I the only person in 2000 to pork this rule?).

I mean..... really.... I'll bet MOST pay no attention when the coach says, "Courtesy Runner for my pitcher!" And out comes little #22.. and NOBODY pays any attention, especially not the enemy coach, and I sort of see the number... but I don't actually STOP PLAY to write it down...

So 2 innings later you hear the same bellow, "Courtesy Runner for my catcher!" And out comes running little #22... and NOBODY pays attention again, and I think.."Is that the same guy, his uniform is SPARKLY WHITE.. uh..."

And a couple pitches get thrown and absolutely nothing is happening, and ALLOF A SUDDEN.. it seems the enemy coach WAS watching, or woke up, or something.. because he wants time to see ME! (who me?) and says, "Hey, Mike, what is the story with little #22 out there, didn't he courtesy run for the pitcher in the 2nd.. I think so, so he can't be out there NOW,right? What are you gonna do, huh? You @#%% #^# of @&*$^&! (OK, he just thinks that..)

DAMN!.. I say.

It only happened once. Now we DO WRITE THEM DOWN!

BTW: What do you think OFTEN happens when this occurs? What did I do? What would I have done under the letter of the law RULES type stuff??

Mike Branch
Member
EWS

[Edited by BJ Moose on Feb 26th, 2001 at 10:56 PM]

[chris s]

No CRs in California, at least FEDwise. MSBL has the "non-runners", which must be declared before the game, max of 2, anybody can run.
Now, a city run over 30 has a real funny CR rule. The CR can be anybody for anybody, BUT the CR can only advance on a ball put into play by a BR actually batting a fair ball, he may tag up on a flyball. NO advancement on a passed ball, no stealing. An overthrow into left field by F2, for instance , with CR being R3, no CR advance, unless ball goes dead. This is treated as an appeal play. Cool, huh

Originally posted by BJ Moose
Bob is, of course, correct. I wonder how many FED umps REALLY know this (or was I the only person in 2000 to pork this rule?).

I mean..... really.... I'll bet MOST pay no attention when the coach says, "Courtesy Runner for my pitcher!" And out comes little #22.. and NOBODY pays any attention, especially not the enemy coach, and I sort of see the number... but I don't actually STOP PLAY to write it down...

So 2 innings later you hear the same bellow, "Courtesy Runner for my catcher!" And out comes running little #22... and NOBODY pays attention again, and I think.."Is that the same guy, his uniform is SPARKLY WHITE.. uh..."

And a couple pitches get thrown and absolutely nothing is happening, and ALLOF A SUDDEN.. it seems the enemy coach WAS watching, or woke up, or something.. becuase he wants time to see ME! (who me?) and says, "Hey, Mike, what is the story with little #22 out there, didn't he courtesy run for the pitcher in the 2nd.. I think so, so he can't be out there NOW,right? What are you gonna do, huh? You @#%% #^# of @&*$^&! (OK, he just thinks that..)

DAMN!.. I say.

It only happened once. Now we DO RIGHT THEM DOWN!

BTW: What do you think OFTEN happens when this occurs? What did I do? What would I have done under the letter of the law RULES type stuff??

Mike Branch
Member
EWS

[Roger Greene]

Come on Moose,
Anybody who claims to know everything you do should know that the UIC is responsible for "recording all... courtsey runner participation, ...." FED 10-2-3j.

Saves a lot of grief when the illegal runner starts out of the dugout, and you say "coach, you can't do that."


Roger Greene,
Member UT

[Edited by Roger Greene on Feb 26th, 2001 at 09:47 PM]

[BJ Moose]

Originally posted by Roger Greene
Come on Moose,
Anybody who claims to know everything you do should know that the UIC is responsible for "recording all... courtsey runner participation, ...." FED 10-2-3j.

[Edited by Roger Greene on Feb 26th, 2001 at 09:47 PM]

Well OF COURSE, I know that NOW! (Actually last spring.) But I didn't actually metamorphose into a god until this winter when I was elightened by the falseness of a post from [name deleted due to oath taken].

Mike Branch
Member
EWS

[oregonblue]

I would add that if you haven't kept good records, and the sitch like Moose's occurred, then no one has official proof that this CR is an illegal substitute. Without that proof, there can be no violation. No one else has this responsibility. It appears to me that this will bite some of my local colleagues eventually. It may slow the game slightly, but I make sure to take the time to record CR's, def conferences, off. conferences, team warnings, etc. A bit of time can avoid the big s(&$%^*%( house later.

Pat, Rogue Valley

[Bfair]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by BJ Moose

BTW: What do you think OFTEN happens when this occurs? What did I do? What would I have done under the letter of the law RULES type stuff??


"...to err is human, to forgive divine" (Alexander Pope)

Call his butt out, get him off the basepath and get on with your game.

Just my opinion,

Steve
Member
EWS

[bob jenkins]

Originally posted by BJ Moose
BTW: What do you think OFTEN happens when this occurs? What did I do? What would I have done under the letter of the law RULES type stuff??


[Edited by BJ Moose on Feb 26th, 2001 at 10:56 PM]

A player who violates a CR rule is an illegal substitute.

Read my recent article ("Accept No Substitutes") to see how to deal with it.

[BJ Moose]

I know he is out. But I would BET that this is one of those situations where IN MOST CASES.. the offending runner is simply removed and a legal one takes his place.. NO OUT gets called. Although, technically, this is not the proper call.

Now that I am completely ANAL about CR recording....I still would HALT the movement of illegal runner before we started play.

Coach: Time Please! Mike, Courtesy Runner for my catcher!
Me: Time! What number? [as #24 comes running out to 2nd]
Coach: #24 Rodriquez
Me: Find another one, coach, he's not eligible.
Coach: Huh?

Can I do this? Should I do this?

[Bfair]

Dan, one thing to remember is that the CR is running for the "position" and not the player in that position.

It is not unusual in Fed ball that F1 and F2 are among the best players on the team. If F1 gets rocked a little bit you might see F1 and F2 swithch positions. When that happens, the CR's stick with the positions they ran for and not the people. I hope you know what I mean.

Just an added thought,

Steve
Member
EWS

[bob jenkins]

Originally posted by BJ Moose
I know he is out. But I would BET that this is one of those situations where IN MOST CASES.. the offending runner is simply removed and a legal one takes his place.. NO OUT gets called. Although, technically, this is not the proper call.

Now that I am completely ANAL about CR recording....I still would HALT the movement of illegal runner before we started play.

Coach: Time Please! Mike, Courtesy Runner for my catcher!
Me: Time! What number? [as #24 comes running out to 2nd]
Coach: #24 Rodriquez
Me: Find another one, coach, he's not eligible.
Coach: Huh?

Can I do this? Should I do this?

Sure -- preventive umpireing to avoid a substitution mistake is always good. You''d do the same think if S1 wanted to reenter, or a starter wanted to reenter for the second time, or a starter wanted to reenter in the wrong spot in the batting order, wouldn't you?