Balk ruling

David B · #1 (**permalink**) Sat Jun 05, 2004, 12:39pm

Teams are always coming up with new plays for a pickoff.

Last night saw one I hadn't seen before.

R3 and pitcher is in windup. Coach calls some type of bunt so I knew something was on (two strikes on the batter), so F1 steps back with his pivot foot and then proceeds to act like he's pitching. He lifts his non pivot, like a pitch and wheels to third to pick off R3. (Actually I thought he was going to pitch the ball it looked like as PU)

My BU and I call a balk and my question is the coach said that they had done this all season long (in HS), and no one had called it a balk.

Now they play OBR rules, and I don't have my books with me but I know FED states that if he makes a move associated with his pitch while not touching the rubber its a balk.

That was the ruling we told the coach, so I told him I'd check on it for him. I hadn't seen this done before and it fooled everyone so that tells me its probably a balk but I thought I'd ask.

So did we miss something or is this a balk?

Thanks
David

Delaware Blue · #2 (**permalink**) Sat Jun 05, 2004, 12:47pm

Yes, he did step back with his pivot foot first which the coach said makes him an infielder.

I misread that part. which could make a big difference.

so F1 steps back with his pivot foot and then proceeds to act like he's pitching. He lifts his non pivot, like a pitch and wheels to third to pick off R3. (Actually I thought he was going to pitch the ball it looked like as PU)

It's a balk if the pitcher makes any motion naturally associated with his pitch while he is not touching the pitcher's plate. Without being there to see it, it sounds like a balk.

[Edited by Delaware Blue on Jun 5th, 2004 at 10:57 PM]

David B · #3 (**permalink**) Sat Jun 05, 2004, 01:46pm

Quote:

Originally posted by Delaware Blue
Sure sounds like a balk to me...

the coach said that they had done this all season long (in HS), and no one had called it a balk.

Interesting since FED rules prohibit F1 from throwing to a base from the wind up. He may only pitch to the batter or step off. In FED, any throw to a base from the wind up position without legally disengaging first is a balk.

OBR allows the pitcher to throw to a base from the wind up as long as he steps directly to the base and makes no move normally associated with the delivery of the pitch.

From J/R
It is a balk if a pitcher:
Commits to pitch but fails to do so. Windup Mode: The pitcher is committed to pitch when there is a movement or step of his non-pivot foot. His joining of hands without movement of either foot does not commit the pitcher to pitch.

It is not a balk if a pitcher steps to: Third, second, or first base from the windup position (without beginning any wind-up motion)...

Yes, he did step back with his pivot foot first which the coach said makes him an infielder.

I agree with that, but he still has to abide by FED which prohits him making moves naturally associated with a pitch.

I'm also going to talk with several of our umpires who did NOT call it a balk and see what they were thinking.

We will be sure and correct this by next season

Thanks
David

jxt127 · #4 (**permalink**) Sat Jun 05, 2004, 09:23pm

I had an F1 the other day who stepped towards first on her delivery. Shes done it for years but this year they are playing with leads and stealing. The association doesn't want us calling balks unless its really blatant. Is my understanding right that this is a balk to step that way.

My first year too calling them.

DG · #5 (**permalink**) Sat Jun 05, 2004, 09:48pm

Quote:

Originally posted by David B
Teams are always coming up with new plays for a pickoff.

Last night saw one I hadn't seen before.

R3 and pitcher is in windup. Coach calls some type of bunt so I knew something was on (two strikes on the batter), so F1 steps back with his pivot foot and then proceeds to act like he's pitching. He lifts his non pivot, like a pitch and wheels to third to pick off R3. (Actually I thought he was going to pitch the ball it looked like as PU)

My BU and I call a balk and my question is the coach said that they had done this all season long (in HS), and no one had called it a balk.

Now they play OBR rules, and I don't have my books with me but I know FED states that if he makes a move associated with his pitch while not touching the rubber its a balk.

That was the ruling we told the coach, so I told him I'd check on it for him. I hadn't seen this done before and it fooled everyone so that tells me its probably a balk but I thought I'd ask.

So did we miss something or is this a balk?

Thanks
David

Clearly a balk. If he makes any motion that appears like a pitch, and does not, it is a balk.

DG · #6 (**permalink**) Sat Jun 05, 2004, 09:51pm

Quote:

Originally posted by David B

Quote:

Originally posted by Delaware Blue
Sure sounds like a balk to me...

the coach said that they had done this all season long (in HS), and no one had called it a balk.

Interesting since FED rules prohibit F1 from throwing to a base from the wind up. He may only pitch to the batter or step off. In FED, any throw to a base from the wind up position without legally disengaging first is a balk.

OBR allows the pitcher to throw to a base from the wind up as long as he steps directly to the base and makes no move normally associated with the delivery of the pitch.

From J/R
It is a balk if a pitcher:
Commits to pitch but fails to do so. Windup Mode: The pitcher is committed to pitch when there is a movement or step of his non-pivot foot. His joining of hands without movement of either foot does not commit the pitcher to pitch.

It is not a balk if a pitcher steps to: Third, second, or first base from the windup position (without beginning any wind-up motion)...

Yes, he did step back with his pivot foot first which the coach said makes him an infielder.

I agree with that, but he still has to abide by FED which prohits him making moves naturally associated with a pitch.

I'm also going to talk with several of our umpires who did NOT call it a balk and see what they were thinking.

We will be sure and correct this by next season

Thanks
David

If he steps back with his pivot foot, he shall make no other movement that resembles a pitch, such as raising his glove and pitching hand together above his head, or moving his non-pivot foot in a manner that would resemble a pitch. If he wants a legal stepoff he just needs to stepoff and keep all his other body parts still.

nickrego · #7 (**permalink**) Sun Jun 06, 2004, 12:11am

I can't tell you how many times a coach has insisted that he has been using a move all year long and that I am the first one to call it.

What they don't remember is that I usually HAVE called it a balk earlier in the season (and I remember it).

That it the standard coach argument to get you not to call it.

Kaliix · #8 (**permalink**) Sun Jun 06, 2004, 12:07pm

As many have correctly stated already, that is a balk.

It was called in a MLB game last week by Hunter Wendlstat on Octavio Dotel of the Houston Astros. Dotel came to the set position with his foot off the rubber and balked home the winning run.

Doooh!

TwoBits · #9 (**permalink**) Tue Jun 08, 2004, 11:51am

I have coaches "test" me on that type of move all the time...one where the pitcher steps off the rubber with his pivot foot and then make a pitching motion. They're reason is the same: "He stepped off with his pivot foot!" I correct them stating they cannot make any motions associated with the pitch. Unfortunately, there are umpires out there who let them get away with this move, and that makes it hard for the ones of us who actually know the rule.