IS THIS A JUDGMENT CALL?

IndianaUmpRef · #1 (**permalink**) Wed Apr 03, 2002, 01:04am

I meant to bring this up a long time ago, but I forgot and (almost a year later) was reminded of it when browsing through on http://www.amateurumpire.com (figured I'd plug them. Nice site.)

On this field that we were on, the ground rules were pretty self-explanatory. Very nice field, with a nice tree-filled background. No holes anywhere or anything like that.

Simple play: A homerun... A BOMB. This one was traveling probably 80-100 feet over the centerfield fence. Bases were empty and so I am the BU at first and do a run out to the outfield just for the hell of it (like I said, we all knew it was out of there) and the PU follows the runner around. Well, I guess its times like this one why we do the "routine"/"just-in-case" stuff. This is one of those cases:

Very high up in the air, I couldn't even attempt to put a distance (from the ground) on it, the ball hits a tree branch above the field of play and falls down in the middle of centerfield. I get a real good look at it.

This was NOT brought up in the pre-game conference with coaches probably because this had never happened before. Like I said, these branches were WAY up.

I want to see what you all would do in this situation before I told you what I did. Just want to see what you all say.

I appreciate any feedback.

Zach

greymule · #2 (**permalink**) Wed Apr 03, 2002, 08:50am

From what you describe, the high tree branches actually overhung the field. If they didn't and were behind the fence, it's a no-brainer. In your case, I'd consider the tree branches similar to an upper deck that overhangs the field. I think left field in the Polo Grounds overhung a little. Home run.

Since the ball was apparently on its way far over the fence, you shouldn't get too much argument. But what if it was a high fly that hit a branch with the fielder camped under it? Good thing to cover in the ground rules next time.

ENelson · #3 (**permalink**) Wed Apr 03, 2002, 10:04am

I agree a Home Run. But if you are at Astros Stadium the ground rule for hitting the roof is where the ball lands. I was at a game this happened. It ended up hitting the roof area in fair territory and falling into foul. It would have been long gone and ended up being a foul ball.

Hopefully they address the brancehes in the ground rules from here on out.

IndianaUmpRef · #4 (**permalink**) Wed Apr 03, 2002, 10:32am

Yes, this particular set of branches does overhang the field.

I did what you all did and called it a home run. I wanted to wait to see if I could get any "no" judgments and reasoning behind it, but this is good enough.

Oh, and don't worry... it's the first thing I bring up during the ground rules at that ballpark now.

Is this a judgment call? I cannot find anything in the ruleebooks that discusses something of this nature.

Zach

greymule · #5 (**permalink**) Wed Apr 03, 2002, 03:30pm

One of my OBR books said something about foliage. It must have been a while back, because the casebook or whatever gave the example of Wrigley Field's ivy-covered fences. The ruling was that if the foliage deflected the ball, there was no catch. However, if a player nestled into the ivy and put his glove up, and the ball just nipped a little foliage and went directly into his glove, that was a catch.

One of our area softball fields has branches overhanging from foul about 20 feet into fair high up down the right field line. Players commonly hit balls over the branches for home runs, and naturally many balls hit the branches. Some balls go over the branches and stay within the park, too. No ground rules seem to work there; no matter what we agree on, there's an argument, mainly because it's often hard to tell whether the ball hit anything. Maybe some township authority will figure out the solution and engage the services of a tree surgeon.

bob jenkins · #6 (**permalink**) Wed Apr 03, 2002, 07:12pm

Quote:

Originally posted by IndianaUmpRef
Yes, this particular set of branches does overhang the field.

I did what you all did and called it a home run. I wanted to wait to see if I could get any "no" judgments and reasoning behind it, but this is good enough.

Oh, and don't worry... it's the first thing I bring up during the ground rules at that ballpark now.

Is this a judgment call? I cannot find anything in the ruleebooks that discusses something of this nature.

Zach

IT's not covered in FED.

In NCAA, the ball is live, unless ground rules to the contrary have been agreed to beforehand.