Quote:
Originally Posted by M&M Guy
Camron - as I read back through the thread, it seems as though in the beginning we actually agreed the initial post was the start of a dribble. I'm not sure where we got off track, other than perhaps you enjoy disagreeing with me. Did I knock over your sandcastle once in a former life?  |
Nah, half the fun is just discecting the rule. Doesn't matter who is takeing up the other point. At least I don't start call you an idiot for disagreeing with me.
Quote:
Originally Posted by M&M Guy
Ok, we agree the action is a dribble. We just now disagree as to whether the "start of a dribble" happens when the ball leaves the hand, or only after it hits the floor the first time. My contention, and JR's contention (post #33), is that the dribble starts when it leaves the hand, and any action thereafter must fall within the guidelines of the dribble rule. (Such as touching it twice before it hits the floor.) The phrase "to the floor" indicates a direction, not a destination.
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This is where I don't necessarily agree. Note the pass rule...."to another player". Does that indicate direction or desitination? It is a destination...the case plays on that are quite clear.
I assert that it is not a dribble at all if it doesn't touch the floor. It always starts on the release, but you can't always be sure what it is until later.
EDIT: In fact, the dribble can be started by throwing the ball in absolutely ANY direction or distance, letting it bounce, the touching the ball again.....so how can "to the floor" be a direction?
Quote:
Originally Posted by M&M Guy
Pretty simple question - we all know the pivot foot cannot be lifted before the dribble is started, as per 4-15-3. If, as you believe, the dribble doesn't start until after the ball has hit the floor, then how come there is no travel violation if the pivot foot is lifted in between the ball leaving the hand and hitting the floor?
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I never claimed the dribble doesn't start until it hits the floor. It starts on the release, but you may not be able to determine if it was a dribble or not until other events happen.
For example, when a player pushes/throws the ball to the floor, is it a bounce pass or a dribble? It would, if it bounces to another player, end up being a pass. If it bounces back to the original ball hander, it would be a dribble.
When it left the hand it was either a pass or a dribble, but you can't tell which until it the next action occurs.