Thread: Dilemma
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Old Thu Apr 21, 2005, 02:55pm
akalsey akalsey is offline
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I said:

Quote:
The guy has a bad angle, the coach asks him to ask you for some help, and although you had more information, you refused to provide it? Instead, how about tell him "Yes, I had a better angle on that play and I had him out." Then let him make up his mind what to do with that information.
You replied (ad hominem attacks removed to keep the discussion civil):

Quote:
akalsey, ... I would never leave my partner out to dry, but on the other hand I will do my job and expect him to do his. If I would have overruled his decision a knowledgeable coach would of had every right to eat my lunch.
Where in my statement did I say (or even suggest) that you overrule your partner? He asks what information you have. You give it to him (and only to him, without anyone else in earshot). He then decides what to do with that information. He might decide you're a moron that wouldn't know safe or out if it bit him. Then he'd stick with his original call. He might decide you're the smartest, most helpful umpire on the planet and reverse his own call. He might even decide that you're right about the call, but he doesn't want to deal with the fallout of reversing his call and so he sticks with the blown call.

But if my partner asks me for information, I give it to him. Then off the field I critique his mechanics, call my assignor, whatever is appropriate. Otherwise, you've left him out to dry, something you say you'd never do.

Later you said:

Quote:
Of course my partner can appeal to me, if the situation dictates. If you think this was an appropreate time to appeal to your partner, then you don't have a clue about me.
Quote:
I cannot reverse his call. This is not my place. He should NEVER had asked to begin with
So you're the one that decides if your partner has all the information he needs on a play? I agree that he shouldn't have needed help on this play: the fact is that he DID go to you for help. And then you hung him out to dry. Guess who's going to look like they were in the wrong now? I don't care what you say to your assignor about this guy's mechanics. If he points out that you ignored him when he appealed to you, you've got a good chance of being assigned to nothing but t-ball.

Even when you're right, if you take the low road, you get mud on you.

I don't see Tim and Rich agreeing with you. Rich points out that he wouldn't have even been looking at the play, so he'd have had nothing to say. Tim's reponse is a little less clear. He "get's short" with umpires who appeal on simple calls, but he doesn't say that he tells them to stick it, that even though he saw the play he won't help, and that he makes this fact known to the dugouts as you apparently did (since the coach immediately starts complaining about your decision).

Your reasoning that if you let your partner appeal to you then the coach is going to appeal on every play doesn't hold water. If your partner asks, you answer. If it becomes a problem with the coach coming out on every play, you can always remind your partner that he's allowed to tell the coaches "no" and you can start making sure that you never see any of the appealed plays. There's better ways to deal with this than cutting your partner off at the knees.

You asked us for help and advice and when you didn't get the advice you were looking for you launched into name calling. Perhaps next time you ask for help instead of answering, we'll tell you that you should already know that and since you shouldn't need help, we refuse to provide it.
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