[cbfoulds]

Originally posted by Carl Childress

Here's the skinny.

Some amateur coaches were playing in NCAA when there was a severe penalty for the action you describe.

Beginning in 1983, the home runner hitter was out when anyone other than the base coach touched him before he touched the plate. (7-11x)

In 1984 they tweaked it a little by adding "after a warning, the batter is out...," etc.

In 1999, the NCAA dropped that statute (7-11x is no longer in the book) and replaced it with: For the action you describe: Warning first offense; ejection, subsequent offenses. (5-2d)

BTW: They also added that other than "preceding base runners" no team member could be on the dirt at home plate. The penalty: Warning first offense; second offense, ejection of "one of the offending players."

That's still the rule in NCAA!

You never mentioned the level of play, so those who rushed to say there is no penalty could be wrong.

Lah, me, everyone is an expert these days. I suppose I had better start reading The Forum daily. (grin)

One thing's sure: The question is not an OOO. In my area, coaches do not permit their players to violate the [non-existent FED] rule. I am always amused when I hear a coach scream: "Stay off the dirt!" It happened in my game Tuesday night. Both coaches had played at the local D1 school.

Personally, I think it would be a positive move for FED to adopt it as well. Some teams visiting in our area clog up the third-base line after a home run. The home team coach always hustles out to demand we enforce the penalty and becomes quite disgruntled when he finds there isn't one.

CC:

As the "wannabe" in question; I will admit that I assumed [and we all know what happens when you do that] a HS or youth game; and further that I don't do enough college ball for it to even register with me that there might be a BRD here [I generally don't post on NCAA topics for exactly that reason]. However, my mea culpa for not having first consulted my Carl Childress library made ; I think you better take another look at the post I was responding to [I've added emphasis to help you out]:

originally posted by Rick Friedmann

I'd go with a team warning if any of them come out without helmets one (even though the ball is in dead-ball territory) - provided the knucklehead batter doesn't stop running and a teammate has to point him to the plate in which case there would be a problem. I'd not take a home run away for exuberance, although I'd remind them that if they did it during a live ball they could be costing their team a run.

Now, again, I'm no NCAA guru, but the rule you are talking about has nothing to do with removing helmets, does it? Nor would a violation cost the team a run if the ball were live, right?

So- if, by chance Brer Friedmann should tell us he was, in fact considering the NCAA rule set [rather than FED]; or if the original post referenced a College game - there is still a problem with giving a team warning for the "violation" cited [removing helmets when the ball is dead], and the penalty threatened [calling the runner out & preventing the run, rather than warning/EJ for the guys on the dirt], correct?

Seems like you are running up a different hill to find a more advantageous battleground: that, or you've somehow found out I didn't order the '05 BRD [sticking w/ '04 for now & making notes in the margins]

And Carl: you really don't think that umpires enforcing "non-existent" [your words] FED rules is Overly Officious?

Lah Me!