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Originally posted by blindzebra
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Originally posted by rwest
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Originally posted by Jurassic Referee
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Originally posted by rwest
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Originally posted by Jurassic Referee
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Originally posted by Back In The Saddle
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The violation occurs the instant the ball is released on the second dribble.
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Can you please cite a rule from somewhere, anywhere to tell us what that violation is? It sureashell ain't a double dribble because the player hasn't dribbled until he touches it after the ball bounces the first time.
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Case 4.15.A: As dribbler A1 attempts to change directions to avoid guard B1, he/she allows the ball to come to rest in one hand in bringing the ball from the right to the left side of the body. A1 pushes the ball to the floor in an attempt to continue the dribble.
Ruling: When A1 palmed/carried the ball, the dribble ended and when he/she PUSHED the ball to the floor a violation occurred (9-5).
The ruling says the violation occurred when he/she pushed the ball, not when he/she touched it after it bounced.
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The case book play uses rule 9-5 as the reference. That rule states that's it's a violation if the player dribbles a second time. The player plain and simply does not dribble a second time if he doesn't touch the ball after he now directed it to the floor after his first dribble ended. There is NO violation committed if the player doesn't touch the ball again.
If a player ends his dribble, then simply stands there and drops the ball and walks away from it without touching it, according to you guys he has just committed a violation. That play is no different than what you're trying to sell above. When you make that call, please let me know how it turns out.
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I'm sorry to belabor the point. Its just no one, until now, has every told me the dribbler had to be the first to touch it after it hits the floor to be considered a double dribble. The only exception to that is case play 4.43.3 as someone pointed out to me. But that is a special case. The case I referenced clearly says the violation occurred when he/she pushed the ball to the floor. No mention is made about touching the ball. In the case you just mentioned, I would not call a double dribble becasue it was obvious she was not dribbling. She abandoned the ball.
I'm sorry this discussion seems to anoy you. Just trying to improve my understanding of the rules.
[Edited by rwest on Feb 3rd, 2005 at 07:46 AM] [/B]
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The play you are quoting is not for an illegal second dribble, it is for PALMING/CARRYING. A1 did not end their dribble, they continued it ILLEGALLY. [/B][/QUOTE]
I'm not arguing the point anymore. However your comment is inaccurate. The case play clearly states the dribble ended. The ruling is repeated below:
Ruling: When A1 palmed/carried the ball, the dribble ended and when he/she PUSHED the ball to the floor a violation occurred (9-5).
This came directly out of the 2004-05 Case Book. Also the case shows up under 4.15 which covers illegal dribble.