SEC Softball: Missouri v S. Carolina 3-8-15

[fdt92]

3rd run

[zm1283]

Originally Posted by fdt92

3rd run

Honest question from a baseball umpire:

Do the NCAA softball powers-that-be actually teach to take the play from where the PU did on the 3rd run? I was watching this game last night and saw this play live. What are the advantages to being up the third base line where he is taking that play? Why not stay on the catcher's glove side hip and have an open look at the play? He missed it because he was completely straight-lined and never saw the tag because the runner was in the way.

[Big Slick]

Originally Posted by zm1283

Honest question from a baseball umpire:

Do the NCAA softball powers-that-be actually teach to take the play from where the PU did on the 3rd run? I was watching this game last night and saw this play live. What are the advantages to being up the third base line where he is taking that play? Why not stay on the catcher's glove side hip and have an open look at the play? He missed it because he was completely straight-lined and never saw the tag because the runner was in the way.

The snapshot does not depict proper NCAA plate mechanics. On this play, if an umpire chases, PU would be in a holding zone between third and home, as he would have responsibilities at both bases. If they throw is home, he would be returning from the holding zone to make this call (but not at this angle/distance). If no umpire chased, he should use a Point of Plate holding zone and read/adjust as the play develops.
Reference: CAA manual page 186 (for when a BU does not chase); page 189 for when a BU chases; page 37 for PU holding zones.

[teebob21]

Originally Posted by Big Slick

The snapshot does not depict proper NCAA plate mechanics. On this play, if an umpire chases, PU would be in a holding zone between third and home, as he would have responsibilities at both bases. If they throw is home, he would be returning from the holding zone to make this call (but not at this angle/distance). If no umpire chased, he should use a Point of Plate holding zone and read/adjust as the play develops.
Reference: CAA manual page 186 (for when a BU does not chase); page 189 for when a BU chases; page 37 for PU holding zones.

To add just a little to this excellent summary, this is poor positioning for a tag play, regardless of base. I judge the umpire to be 12-14 feet minimum from the play (and maybe more depending on how much zoom compression there is in that shot), when ideally he should be within 6-10 feet. He also did not get to a 90-degree angle on either the path of the runner, or the motion of the tag. Correct calling depth on 1st base line extended would have given the umpire the vision to see the tag over the top (90 degrees from path of runner), and 3BLX (90 degrees from motion of tag) would have given the blue pretty much the same picture we can see in the still photo.

That said, sometimes we all get caught a step behind. The important thing is to work on reducing those times to as close as zero as we can get it (especially if you work D1).

[IRISHMAFIA]

AFA umpire's position in the snapshot where the PU is making the call, if he did have 3rd to cover, without seeing the play unfold, I really don't know if he had time to get into a better position. I do, however, agree he is too deep into foul territory no matter what he had to cover.

[EsqUmp]

Umpire in terms of priority. Being too far up the 3rd base line in order to see the runner hit the base is a poor and unacceptable excuse for not being in position for the play at the plate. Umpire must return to the point of the plate and adjust for the play.

You can see a runner hit/miss a base from almost anywhere on the field; and if it's so close that you need a micrometer to tell, you're not calling the out.

The game is about scoring runs and preventing the opponent from scoring runs. There is nothing more fundamental than that. Therefore, poor positioning should never be an excuse for violating the fundamentals of the game.

That said, I only see the tag. I'd presume the ball stayed in the glove and there were no control issues based on others' comments.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by EsqUmp

Umpire in terms of priority. Being too far up the 3rd base line in order to see the runner hit the base is a poor and unacceptable excuse for not being in position for the play at the plate. Umpire must return to the point of the plate and adjust for the play.

You can see a runner hit/miss a base from almost anywhere on the field; and if it's so close that you need a micrometer to tell, you're not calling the out.

The game is about scoring runs and preventing the opponent from scoring runs. There is nothing more fundamental than that. Therefore, poor positioning should never be an excuse for violating the fundamentals of the game.

That said, I only see the tag. I'd presume the ball stayed in the glove and there were no control issues based on others' comments.

And if there was a possible play @ 3B? Or maybe there was already a play @ 3B and this was a subsequent play. We don't know.

I do agree that the plate is the priority. However, the point of the plate is not where an umpire goes if s/he is responsible for any play at more than one base.

[KJUmp]

Originally Posted by Big Slick

The snapshot does not depict proper NCAA plate mechanics. On this play, if an umpire chases, PU would be in a holding zone between third and home, as he would have responsibilities at both bases. If they throw is home, he would be returning from the holding zone to make this call (but not at this angle/distance). If no umpire chased, he should use a Point of Plate holding zone and read/adjust as the play develops.
Reference: CAA manual page 186 (for when a BU does not chase); page 189 for when a BU chases; page 37 for PU holding zones.

Watched a highlight video of the play on the SC website…..runners on 1st&2nd fly ball off the base of the fence in left center, U3 chased.

BR rounds 2nd hard, with U1 right with her as there was a bobble by the outfielder picking up the ball, and while not shown, possibly a hesitation (mishandle?) by the F6 on the cutoff.
Not a wide enough shot off the entire play to see the reason that the PU came back to the plate at the angle and distance shown in the pic. Video does show him clearly behind the runner as she coming up the 3rd base line as the play is developing. Does not show if he utilized the holding zone. So yes, he's 'late', but all the information that might tells us why, and help us learn from the play, is not available on the video.
It's a tough coverage just reviewing it in the Manual, tougher in real time.