ASA 2015 Rule Changes

[Andy]

2015 Playing Rule Changes and Comments

Rule 1, Stealing A: Adds Junior Olympic Boys 18 and Under and Men’s 21 and Under
classification of play to those who can steal in Slow Pitch.
Comment: Allows Junior Olympic Boys 18U and Men 21U to steal in Slow Pitch.

Rule 2, Section 1: The pitching distance for Women’s Modified classification of play
shall be 43 feet.
Comment: Changes the pitching distance in Women’s Modified Pitch to 43 feet.

Rule 3, Section 3F [2]: EFFECTIVE 2016 The use of the yellow optic cover, red stitch
11-inch ball with a core of .520 or under and a compression of 300.0 lbs. for Women’s
Slow Pitch, Coed Slow Pitch (Women batters only), Women’s Seniors, Women’s
Masters and Boy’s and Girl’s Junior Olympic Slow Pitch.
Comment: Allows the use of the 52/300 11-inch ball in 2016 for all of the above
classifications of play.

Rule 4, Section 1D[2A] Exception: In all Junior Olympic Fast Pitch Pool Play Only;
When a team elects to bat more than nine batters the game will continue with the
skipped batter being recorded as an out whenever a player leaves the game for any
reason other than an ejection. Teams cannot play with less than 8 players.
Comment: Defines the shorthanded rule when batting more than 9 batters in all
Junior Olympic Fast Pitch pool play.

Rule 5, Section 5A [2] EXCEPTION: Removes Senior Slow Pitch classification of play
from those who have to run out home runs.
Comment: Allows for Senior’s to choose not to run the basses on a Home Run
or Four Base Award.

Rule 5, Section 9A [3]b: Senior Slow Pitch Run Ahead Rule will be – 20 after 4
innings and 15 after 5 innings.
Comment: Removes Run Ahead Rule after 3 innings and defines the new run
ahead rule for Senior’s Slow Pitch Classification of Play.

Rule 5, Section 10A Exception:

(Code310P) The Championship and “If” game in
Junior Olympic 10 and Under ASA/USA Championship will have a two hour time limit.
Comment: Allows for the Junior Olympic 10U ASA/USA only to have a 2 hour
time limit in the Championship and “IF” game.

Rule 7 Section 2E: (Fast Pitch) In Junior Olympic Pool Play only, teams have the
option of having all roster players present bat. The Shorthanded Rule that applies to
Fast Pitch will apply.

Rule 4, Section 1 [a-d] and 2 [a-g] Exception
Comment: Allows Junior Olympic Fast Pitch teams to bat everyone in pool play.

Rule 7 Section 3D: (Junior Olympic) After entering the batter’s box, the batter must
remain in the box with at least one foot between pitches and while taking signals and
practice swings.
Comment: Removes the requirement to keep one foot in the batter’s box for
Modified Pitch Classification of Play.

[AtlUmpSteve]

Andy, was there any discussion about the courtesy runner rule application if a team batted the roster in pool play? Obviously, teams that want to use the rule will be thinking the last out being able to run; while the absence of a rule means they don't have anyone eligible to run.

[Andy]

Originally Posted by AtlUmpSteve

Andy, was there any discussion about the courtesy runner rule application if a team batted the roster in pool play? Obviously, teams that want to use the rule will be thinking the last out being able to run; while the absence of a rule means they don't have anyone eligible to run.

The courtesy runner was not brought up. The main discussion points centered around the shorthanded rule. The NUS indicated the if a team had 13 players and elected to bat all 13 and two became injured, the game would be a forfeit per the current shorthanded rule. The proposals were amended to adjust the shorthanded rule and passed.

My best guess is that the courtesy runner rule will remain unchanged. if a team wants to "bat the roster", they will not be able to use a courtesy runner.

[BretMan]

Suppose I have 15 players in my dugout. Are my only options:

- Bat 9.

- Bat 15.

What I'm getting at is the new rule seems to say you can bat "everybody". Can you leave a couple on the bench and bat, say, 12 or 13? Is batting "everybody" all or nothing?

[CecilOne]

Originally Posted by BretMan

Suppose I have 15 players in my dugout. Are my only options:

- Bat 9.

- Bat 15.

What I'm getting at is the new rule seems to say you can bat "everybody". Can you leave a couple on the bench and bat, say, 12 or 13? Is batting "everybody" all or nothing?

If the wording is what we have seen, good catch!
Presumably not the intent, but the rule as presented.

[Andy]

Originally Posted by BretMan

Suppose I have 15 players in my dugout. Are my only options:

- Bat 9.

- Bat 15.

What I'm getting at is the new rule seems to say you can bat "everybody". Can you leave a couple on the bench and bat, say, 12 or 13? Is batting "everybody" all or nothing?

The same questions was asked as the change was being debated...the intent is to allow the team to bat "up to" the entire roster.

[CecilOne]

Originally Posted by Andy

The same questions was asked as the change was being debated...the intent is to allow the team to bat "up to" the entire roster.

Assumed, but will that be published.

[Manny A]

Originally Posted by Andy

The same questions was asked as the change was being debated...the intent is to allow the team to bat "up to" the entire roster.

So in Bret's scenario, if he has 15 at the game and decides to bat 12, and he loses one due to injury, he's not allowed to enter one of his three remaining bench players to replace her? And then if he loses a second starter due to injury, he has to forfeit due to the shorthanded rule?

[Andy]

Here is the official interpretation released from ASA:




This year the ASA/USA Council passed a new rule for 2015 allowing for up to all players on the roster present to be able to bat in all Junior Olympic Classifications of Play during Pool Play. The rule passed added a clause for how the shorthanded rule would be handled. The new rules as listed in the 2015 ASA Participant Manual reads as follows:

Rule 4, Section 1D[2A] Exception: In all Junior Olympic Fast Pitch Pool Play Only; When a team elects to bat more than nine batters the game will continue with the skipped batter being recorded as an out whenever a player leaves the game for any reason other than an ejection. Teams cannot play with less than 8 players.

Rule 7 Section 2F: (Fast Pitch) In Junior Olympic Pool Play only, teams have the option of having up to all players on the roster present bat. The Shorthanded Rule that applies to Junior Olympic Fast Pitch will apply. Rule 4, Section 1 [a-d] and 2 [a-g] Exception
This new rule did not address all the other aspects of our rules like Substitutes and Courtesy Runners. Based on the intent of the rule being that all players may bat and those over the 9 starters in the batting order could be substitutes and based on our Courtesy Runner rule as defined we have the following interpretation on how this rule should be administered during Junior Olympic Pool Play.
• Batting Order: All players on the roster up to the total amount of players present on the roster may bat. Whatever number you start with must remain the same unless you lose players as mentioned in the rule. EXAMPLE: If you start with 12 batters you cannot increase to 13 batters or decrease to 11 batters.






• Shorthanded Rule: When a team elects to bat more than nine batters the game will continue with the skipped batter being recorded as an out whenever a player leaves the game for any reason other than an ejection. Teams cannot play with less than 8 players. If a team loses a player from the batting order due to an ejection the game would end in a forfeit. EXAMPLE: If a team bat’s 15 and all they have are 15, no subs, and they lose one batter due to ejection, the game would end in a forfeit.
• When using a DP/FLEX: If a team uses the DP/FLEX rule the flex will still be listed at the end of the batting order. If a team decides to bat the FLEX they may do so. However, the FLEX may only bat for the DP in the DP’s batting position. Then DP would be then considered out of the game and may re-enter one time. EXAMPLE: A team is batting 12 and using the DP/FLEX. They would list their 12 batters with the DP being in one of the first nine positions and the FLEX listed in the 13th spot.
• Defensive Substitutes: Players not listed as a starting player or DP/FLEX, first 9 spot in the batting order, may be used as a substitute on defense. The batting order will not be changed and the re-entry rule would still be in effect. EXAMPLE: Batter number 11 goes in to play defense at shortstop for batter 3. Batter 11 has now entered the game and batter 3 has left the game. They still bat in the 3 and 11 positions as they originally did. Re-entry rule still in effect
• Offensive Substitutes: Players not listed as a starting player, first 9 spot in the batting order, may be used as a substitute on offense like a pinch runner. The batting order will not be changed and the re-entry rule would still be in effect. EXAMPLE: Batter number 4 gets a hit and batter 12 goes in to pinch run. Batter 4 has left the game and batter 12 has entered the game. They still bat in positions 4 and 12 as they originally did. Re-entry rule still in effect.
• Pinch Hitters: No player listed in the batting order may pinch hit for any of the first nine players listed or anyone else listed in the batting order. They must stay in the batting order position they started in. The only players allowed to pinch hit are those players not listed in the batting order.
• Courtesy Runner: No player starting in the batting order may be used as a Courtesy Runner for the pitcher and or catcher. In order to be a Courtesy Runner a player cannot have participated in the game in any fashion. EXAMPLE: If a team has 15 players and wants two Courtesy Runners they can only bat 13 players.
We hope this addresses any and all issues in regard to batting all players in Junior Olympic Pool Play. If other situations arise we will use the same thinking to try and resolve them.

[youngump]

Originally Posted by Andy

• Offensive Substitutes: Players not listed as a starting player, first 9 spot in the batting order, may be used as a substitute on offense like a pinch runner. The batting order will not be changed and the re-entry rule would still be in effect. EXAMPLE: Batter number 4 gets a hit and batter 12 goes in to pinch run. Batter 4 has left the game and batter 12 has entered the game. They still bat in positions 4 and 12 as they originally did. Re-entry rule still in effect.

This is going to be a mess... and to make it even more fun it's a mess that we're only going to see in championship play which means that we won't be at all ready for it. And so it'll all get made up on the fly.
They better make a ruling for what happens when the girl due up is on base and they better make a rule for when you can pull her off base to solve that situation. For example, B10 is on base when B9 strikes out. If B10 is to be skipped can they then put B11 in for B10 or is it too late for that? Same question if B10 is to be out.
Now when they put B15 in for B10 has B10 left the game. By the logic above B10 wasn't in the game so how can she leave the game? Or can one only pinch run for the starting nine?

Editing to add one more: 15 players available, 14 listed on the lineup. B14 reaches 1st. S15 replaces B14. S15 steals Second and Third and then B1 reaches on a single scoring S15. S15 now pinch runs for B1. Legal?

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by youngump

This is going to be a mess... and to make it even more fun it's a mess that we're only going to see in championship play which means that we won't be at all ready for it. And so it'll all get made up on the fly.
They better make a ruling for what happens when the girl due up is on base and they better make a rule for when you can pull her off base to solve that situation. For example, B10 is on base when B9 strikes out. If B10 is to be skipped can they then put B11 in for B10 or is it too late for that?

There is already a precedent for such a rule. It is in 8.9.C.2. This will probably be the ruling for such a situation.

[youngump]

Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA

There is already a precedent for such a rule. It is in 8.9.C.2. This will probably be the ruling for such a situation.

Sort of, the problem is that you can't buy yourself out of a 8.9.C.2 out by courtesy running for your courtesy runner (because of 8.9.C.4 which is what justifies the latter part of C2). But you could get yourself out of a substitution problem with a switch if you did it before the out. But what about right when that spot is due up.

[xtremeump]

POOL-PLAY !!!!! Championship Play is Book Rule.

[IRISHMAFIA]

• Defensive Substitutes: Players not listed as a starting player or DP/FLEX, first 9 spot in the batting order, may be used as a substitute on defense. The batting order will not be changed and the re-entry rule would still be in effect. EXAMPLE: Batter number 11 goes in to play defense at shortstop for batter 3. Batter 11 has now entered the game and batter 3 has left the game. They still bat in the 3 and 11 positions as they originally did. Re-entry rule still in effect
• Offensive Substitutes: Players not listed as a starting player, first 9 spot in the batting order, may be used as a substitute on offense like a pinch runner. The batting order will not be changed and the re-entry rule would still be in effect. EXAMPLE: Batter number 4 gets a hit and batter 12 goes in to pinch run. Batter 4 has left the game and batter 12 has entered the game. They still bat in positions 4 and 12 as they originally did. Re-entry rule still in effect.

This is ridiculous. How can you have left the game if you are still batting? The re-entry rule IS and always has been based upon the offensive line-up. WTF, why not just bat whoever, whenever and let any 9 play defense. After all, if you are going to screw something up, you just as well screw it up real good

We hope this addresses any and all issues in regard to batting all players in Junior Olympic Pool Play. If other situations arise we will use the same thinking to try and resolve them.

Too late

[CecilOne]

Originally Posted by Andy

• Defensive Substitutes: Players not listed as a starting player or DP/FLEX, first 9 spot in the batting order, may be used as a substitute on defense. The batting order will not be changed and the re-entry rule would still be in effect. EXAMPLE: Batter number 11 goes in to play defense at shortstop for batter 3. Batter 11 has now entered the game and batter 3 has left the game. They still bat in the 3 and 11 positions as they originally did. Re-entry rule still in effect
• Offensive Substitutes: Players not listed as a starting player, first 9 spot in the batting order, may be used as a substitute on offense like a pinch runner. The batting order will not be changed and the re-entry rule would still be in effect. EXAMPLE: Batter number 4 gets a hit and batter 12 goes in to pinch run. Batter 4 has left the game and batter 12 has entered the game. They still bat in positions 4 and 12 as they originally did. Re-entry rule still in effect.

Besides this being a bad idea,
the wording first say "first 9 spot(s?) ... may be used;
then uses the 11th and 12th positions as examples.