PONY/ASA rule questions
 

Bases empty, 1-0 count, batter hits a dribbler well foul up the 3rd base line. Catcher retrieves the ball, tosses it to F5, who throws it to F1.
PONY sez ball is awarded and count is now 2-1. Is ASA's rule 6.7.B interpreted the same way?

Question 2
ASA 8.7.L (exception) calls for runner and batter/runner to be called out when runner interferes with a routine fly ball, fair or foul. Same in PONY?
PONY 8.11.i has the same penalty when runner intentionally interferes with the fielder's attempt to throw to complete a play. Same in ASA?

Sorry, not finding the answers to these questions in the books.
Looking forward to the new season, and a busy forum!

PONY 8.3.d is referring to a non-batted ball. To rule otherwise would require the catcher to always get the ball and return it to the pitcher, regardless of the situation. The wording could be cleaned up a bit.

PONY 8.4: The batter is out when an offensive team member interferes on a fly foul ball.

Speaking ASA

No, and I also doubt PONY does. The reference is to a pitched ball, not a batted ball. Even then, I would not even consider making that ruling unless it was obvious the catcher was avoiding throwing the ball to the pitcher.

8.7.J.2

I agree it's a harsh ruling Mike, but in PONY rulebook, that's actually the example play they use to describe the rule 7.3.e (play)

In the 2nd play,

The ASA equivalent of the PONY play described is actually 8.7.J.4, but even that allows for the runner to be called out only (not in a double play situation):
Ground ball to shortstop. R1, running from 2B, intentionally hits F6's arm as she attempts to throw to F3.
PONY 8.11.i: runner and batter/runner out.
ASA 8.7.J.4: runner out. The EXCEPTION only applies to an ordinary-effort fly ball, fair or foul.


I want to get this right. Thanks for your input

That is a PONY issue. I specifically replied to ASA's ruling as you requested.

Again, specifically you noted interfering with a fielder attempting to throw the ball which is specifically addressed in J.2 (2012 book). J.4 refers to a deflected batted ball.

I think you are talking about two different things. I only replied to the issue of INT with a fielder attempting to throw the ball.

If you are referencing the 2013 book, I'm not there yet.

Sorry Mike, thought I was looking at a new ASA pdf online; my J.4 pertains to a direct hit, not a deflected ball. Let me get my sub-sections straight so I can sound sensible.

If you are saying yours haven't been received, yet, I suggest you question up the chain of command. I received direct ship team books for my leagues 2+ weeks ago, and umpire books from our UIC almost 2 weeks ago.

If you want a PONY ruling, listen to people involved with PONY.

Already did. This are a little strange here at this point in time.

Fair or Foul?
 

If the ball is hit and bounces off the pitching rubber and rolls fouls (before 1st or 3rd). Is this fair or foul?

Does it matter if the rubber is 40' or 43'?

What about if it hits 2nd base then rolls foul (although unlikely)?

Thanks!

All of the above are about non-touched.

Yes, all non touched. The part about 40' vs 43' feet was asked since a local varsity coach was telling me that there is a imaginary line drawn between 1st and 3rd. With a 40' rubber it is in front of the line and 43' is behind this line. He said if it hit the 43' rubber it is fair but 40' it is foul (if they both roll foul untouched). I didn't think he was correct, but can't find a rule to show him.

Well, there's a reason why you can't find a rule to show him... :rolleyes:

The whole "imaginary line between first and third" thing is a ruling unique to FED baseball. It doesn't apply to softball so, of course, there is no mention of it in the softball rule book.

In FED there is no imaginary line that if the ball passes it it becomes fair. Look at rule 2-20, not going to type it word for word, but the ball has to touch 1st, 2nd or 3rd before going into foul territory to be considered a fair ball. Now look at the case play for 2-20. B1 hits a fly ball in the infield that falls untouched (b) behind the pitching circle, but just in front of second base. After hitting the ground, the ball continues to spin and rolls between home and first base and comes to rest in foul ground. RULING: (b) foul ball.

thank you! Thank you! Thank you!:d

Not Fed. OBR. (And NCAA too, I think).

Seems to me Dixie softball ruled this way too, but I've not worked that in 14 years, and will never again, so I've not bothered keeping up with any changes.

Yes, FED!

(NFHS Baseball) 2-5-1b: A fair ball is a batted ball which...contacts fair ground on or beyond an imaginary line between first and third base.

For OBR and NCAA baseball, "beyond the bases" is defined as being past the direct line between first, second, third- same as NFHS softball.

If memory serves correctly, at one time NFHS softball was the same as baseball, but changed a while back.

Yes, NFHS Softball used to use the string theory for fair/foul, but changed. Unlike baseball, it simply said it is a fair ball if the batted ball first landed beyond first or third base, and NFHS people applied the baseball ruling. The only way to get (sometimes baseball) umpires to address the softball rule was to change the wording.

Similar with the interpretation most apply to when a catcher needs to wear a mask. Softball (all versions) says any time warming up a pitcher; but most people choose to ignore if warming up a pitcher and standing up. I submit that if that was what softball wanted, it would say what baseball says, that the catcher must wear a mask when squatting to assume a catching position.

I know I can't figure out how it is warming up if the catcher is squatting, but not warming up if standing; either way, the pitcher is being warmed up. But, I also know that will not change without adding more specific language to the rule; just like happened in NFHS.

From a discussion I had back in 2009 specific to NFHS. I'll check current NFHS book when I get it.

Page 17 of the Softball Rules Book, Rule 1, Section 7, Art. 3...(FP) Any non-adult warming up a pitcher at any location within the confines of the field shall wear an approved catcher's helmet and mask combination and throat protector.

Note that it does not say anything about whether the catcher is standing or squatting. If both players are throwing overhand, the mask is not required.

See also Case Book 1.7.3 Situations A & B, on page 11.

"Warming up a pitcher" apparently means that one of the participants is throwing underhand, as in the pitching delivery.

Last year's case book said that if a non-adult did not have the approved helmet/mask/throat protector, the catcher may not warm up the pitcher. The two players may play catch.

It has nothing to do with whether the catcher is upright, squatting, or on 1 or both knees.